I started working at my current job over eight years ago. I have a great job…I’d like to say I’m lucky, but frankly I worked my butt off to get the education and the job, and I’ve worked my butt off to be successful.
When I started there was a woman who had started a month or two before me. We work in education. She was my counterpart in another grade level division.
How can I describe her? She is judgmental, snippy, backbiting…and a martyr. She has always belittled me and tried to be in competition. She would drop by my office on Friday afternoons and say, “I put in 55 hours this week…how many did you put in?”
Well, frankly, I’m very focused and am able to get my work done in a reasonable amount of time. I also have a life outside of work, and every hour I spend at work past the time of true production, is an hour I’m taking away from my family and my mental health. I believe in balance.
Please don’t get me wrong. I have my faults and weaknesses, but I have tried over and over with her. I have included her in conferences I attended, meetings I planned, emails I sent – just so she would be part of what I was doing. I believe in keeping people in the loop and informed.
She is secretive and suspicious and questions me relentlessly about what I’m doing and why. I have made every hotel reservation, every flight arrangement, every registration form for her for eight years. And I always keep an extra copy for her because I know she’ll lose the first one I give her. She operates twenty minutes behind all the time.
I have defended her to other employees for eight years. (Other people have had problems with her as well.)
Last week we took a group of principals to an out-of-state conference. (I made ALL her arrangements for that.)
She treated me like a dog. She was rude to me, and she rolled her eyes at my professional contributions. The principals noticed, and one female principal asked me how I could work with her and why I was putting up with that treatment.
Let me say that I am a strong, confident, independent person, but I did not want to engage in any disagreements or petty sniping in front of anyone – or in private for that matter. We were there to learn and her comments were hurtful and embarrassing. But then was not the time to engage her – and I have refused to engage her at work either. Only once did I do that when I told her that if she thought she could do a better job than me, she was welcome to the project. That shut her up for a time being.
The night before our last day of work at the conference, we all were at dinner. I received a phone call during dinner that one of my best, sweetest, most supportive friends had lost her battle with cancer. I was heartbroken, but not surprised.
That night, I had a sore throat and I couldn’t sleep because of my throat and because I couldn’t stop thinking about my friend and her family and what a devastating time the past two years had been for them.
The next morning we all met to finalize our plans. We were brainstorming to develop our final product and she kept saying, “You aren’t making any sense. You said we couldn’t do this. You are all over the place.”
I was stunned. One of the principals dropped his head – he told me later he fully expected me to come back at her. The female middle school principal said, “Gee, I thought I left middle school girls back at school.” She also said she couldn’t believe I didn’t respond to her remarks.
The third principal literally sat there with his mouth open. He and I have been friends for years, and he said he couldn’t believe that she would do that to me knowing my friend had died just the night before and that it was clear I was exhausted and sad.
All three did remark at that time that they thought this was a brainstorming session before the final plan and that they thought we were on the right track.
I wanted to leave and have a good cry, but I felt a responsibility to the group to finish the work and minimize the drama.
She seemed quite satisfied that she had “won” her point.
While she went to the restroom, the female princpal kept remarking how uncomfortable she had been and frankly she thought D was a bitch. She said, “There’s just no other word for it.”
I said, “Well, at some point today, she will either say she has a migraine or she’s sick to her stomach or under a lot of stress or something. Then she’ll say she hopes nobody took her the wrong way but she’s just so sick she doesn’t know what she’s saying.”
At the airport, that’s exactly what happened. She went on and on about how sick she felt and how she had a headache…and nobody said a word to her.
I have had it. I’ll be 55 in June and she just turned 55. We have a new boss who hasn’t seen through her yet – she’s all over him. AND…I’m not going to a boss and complain and whine about her treatment of me. THAT is middle school. We have no Human Resources Department that mediates in these instances.
I am seething because I feel like if I say something to her, the martyr syndrome will kick in and she’ll run to the boss and cry and whine (her standard mode).
If this was just ME who has these feelings, I’d say the problem is me. But I have some very, very good friends in our system who are honest with me when I ask for advice or clarification. I have asked them – and given them permission – to BE honest and tell me if I have provoked her or done anything to deserve this treatment.
They say she is jealous of me and feels insecure. Again, I have included her in everything and have been supportive.
Help. I would change jobs – but I’m almost 55 – and changing jobs doesn’t happen that easily.
I need someone to tell me how to handle this. Do I just ignore her and keep my distance? Do I confront her and risk her running to the new boss and poisoning his opinion of me?
Do I exercise like a mad woman, march on, be myself, and try to forget it?
Sorry for the long post…I had to get this out of my system.
Public television used to have a chair yoga program. Most seniors groups also have chair yoga. Search the net for a dvd, should be there.
Very beautiful. I meditate when I get home from work. I get up at 5:30 and just can't get motivated to get up any earlier. When I wake up in the middle of the night, I immediately go to prayer. It's comforting. Teresa
You amaze me. For eight years you’ve tolerated this abusive nightmare of a woman and managed to do your job and win the admiration of your coworkers. You’ve kept your mouth shut even during the most intolerable of conditions, managed to keep from gossiping about her, and been strong and capable and competent. You say it’s a great job, so I assume that you enjoy your work. You obviously aren’t going to let this Bword drive you away. So, what to do? Wow. I would probably have murdered her about 7.5 years ago, so I might not be the right person to ask, but I’ve been up all night (long story), and it’s still not light PDT, so you get me anyway.
First, I’d just stop. I might tell her that I was stopping, but you can eliminate that step. No more helping her with anything at all that isn’t required. No making travel arrangements, no nothing. I would maintain civility, period, because you don’t need the aggravation of an open war. Just stop. You have a job, you will do it, and well, but you won’t do hers. She will get exactly what she deserves. Nothing. No inclusion. No emails. No travel arrangements. If she approaches you, which may or may not happen, you can simply say that you are done. You tried for 8 years, got nothing but nastiness in return, and you are officially done. If you fear that you might not be able to state it all clearly and unemotionally, write it all down and keep it handy for the day that she confronts you. Hand it to her and walk away. You could use the same examples that you used here.
There was a time when I believed that people like her would be recognized and fired, but I’ve seen too many coast forever and even promoted (moved up just to get rid of them), so I’m not recommending that you go to management. Just protect yourself as best you can, and stop trying to change her (if that’s what your incredible ongoing kindness to her has been). She won’t change. We really do teach people how to treat us, and as long as you are willing to be kind and helpful to her no matter how rotten she is, she will be willing and eager to be horrible to you.
Abso-posit-tivley- lutly!!! You said it perfectly — and — would it be important or not to ask yourself (Vicky) what you have been getting out of this for 8 years besides blatant abuse??
Great advice!
Thank you! You’re right…I’ve been trying to change her. And she is rotten. Whew! For some reason I kept thinking that there has to be a good person somewhere down inside her…but I don’t think there is. She does all the “right” things. She’s involved in her church, she talks about “helping the children,” she makes a big deal out of every, single thing she does that might put her in a good light.
But you know what? She is rotten to the core. And I’m through trying to help her.
And you’re also right…I keep expecting her to be reprimanded in some way – but that won’t happen either.
AND…I think what’s really wrong with me is that I’m angry with myself for putting up with her all this time – and for thinking it’s ME.
I’ve known several like your co worker, unfortunately.
You never said if it was part of your job description to make her travel plans. If not, that would be the first thing to go! Let her do her own – she has time, since she’s there 55 hrs a week. ; )
As far as being in church – oh my. Having served in lay ministry for over 20 yrs, been home fellowship leaders, etc etc, we’ve also seen a lot of her type in church. It is both a self-esteem issue (believe it or not, LOW self-esteem) and a control issue. Some women (and yes, it is mostly women who do this, not as much with the men) feel the need to be involved in every possible thing in their church. This isn’t how it is supposed to function. We all have our callings and strong points, and when we all get into the right places, things work well. However, there are a lot like your co worker who cram in where they shouldn’t be. I would imagine you could get a lot of sympathy from people at her church about her as well! She more than likely attempts to control things there, and be very active just so she does not feel left out of anything.
It is really a sad deal. There’s no good answer, and I agree with what you said – you liked your job, and it isn’t that easy to change after 50!
I’ve found personally that there are not a lot of decent options. However, one I have indeed used successfully is to pray for that person. Doesn’t matter I suppose if you have a lot of faith or not, but it would help! But, I don’t pray for evil things to happen (even though that has danced through my mind! LOL!). Quite the opposite – I pray that they are blessed – with a better job! I pray that they get offered a job of their dreams at another company.
Why? Well first off, when you start praying for things, it can open a door for the same in your own life – I’d want a better job, not a worse one, so wouldn’t curse someone with a worse job or no job. Then, either way, it’s a win-win situation. Either they leave for a better job, or you get one. It has happened more than once.
There have still been a few places that have intolerable co-workers that just don’t seem to get anything but their own way. Still not sure how they manage to plow over everyone including bosses!
My last place had the jerk who kept porn in his desk and bragged about it, played his radio and talked so loudly you couldn’t hear your own phone conversations. It was a nightmare, but he still had a job. Must’ve been a miracle.
Anyway, stop making her travel plans, and don’t do more than you need to for her. She’s an adult, and unless you are her secretary or formally given the responsibility of planning her trips, stop doing it. Good luck to you! Sounds like you have a load of patience.
Vicky, Take KG’s advice and don’t become ”a martyr” in the other direction!…TRACK
The last thing I want to be is a martyr! Thanks, TRACK…sometimes I just need somebody to say, “Hey…what the heck are you doing?”
YOU HAVE BEEN A DOORMAT! Demand respect and you will get it. All this time she has mistaken your politeness for weakness. Peoplearound you are uncomfortable with this situation but more so at you for not speaking out to defend yourself. Ironically, this same situation has been happening to a coworker which i will call her Maria, for the last 1-1/2 years. I have told Maria to speak up and demand respect. She kept telling me “I have a really bad temper, if i open my mouth it will be really bad”. Well, she has been taking this other woman’s crap for 1-1/2 years! The last episode was last week. Maria made a double chocolate cake and it flopped, but still she cut it into pieces and made it look like brownies. It tasted fine. The other woman bursted out “it looks like a chunk of doo”, but in a more vulgar way. Maria went in her office and started crying. I sit all the way in the back of the office so of course i was not aware of this. Finally, Maria’s husband told her …. you better confront her. She would not but she stopped talking to her altogether. The other woman sent her a text “what is happening… did i do something that bothered you?” The woman is freaking dense. Finally Maria, wrote her an email telling her “i will speak to you at work about things that concern our jobs, you are not my friend since i suspect you never liked me and you will take any chance to insult me in front of others, that is not only rude but uncalled for”. Well now, she is as peaceful as a lamb. FINALLY, THE WHOLE OFFICE CAN HAVE SOME PEACE. Do the same!! Nobody likes a doormat. Is this woman your boss? Why are u taking her crap? Defend yourself, be firm you do not have to be rude or stoop to her level, but let it be know that you “are tired of this and are not going to take it anymore!” Let us know what happens. Sorry i just do not understand how can you take this behavior for 8 years, i will not tolerate it for one hour. I give people chances, as everybody has a bad day. But twice? Hell no! Bullies know who to harrass. DO NOT BE A VICTIM, it is not sexy.
Thank you for your response. I would LOVE to read her the riot act. Actually her behavior has gotten much worse with the new boss. The other two people pretty much saw through her and kept a tighter rein on her. This one is super nice, would never imagine anyone could be like her, and just hasn’t seen her for what she is.
I think I’m going to have to find a balance between maintaining my professionalism at work and not being a doormat. I talked about this with my grown daughters who know her and frankly don’t like her at all. They suggested I just tell her that I think her behavior is unacceptable, unprofessional, and crosses the line into my personal space. Well…one of my daughters…who is a law student and who works for a lawyer said, “Well, just hit her and we’ll defend you.” LOL!
Thanks again…it’s great to get different perspectives!
Good, we want feedback. Let us know what happens. Take your time.
I agree 100% with KG; no more enabling her – you can’t help her and you can’t fix her. Let her do her own job and you do yours. ♥
I have found that 99% of what people do/say negative, abusive about you is due to…..jealousy!
I would speak to her in private and tell her you see what is going on…..list her behavior and tell her that….we are supposed to be professionals and her behavior is abusive and unacceptabe….i would also tell her that “unless you speak to me with respect, I will not respond to you.” Her behavior is a CHOICE (unless she has some underlying other problem…physical or emotional).
Unless she has Tourette’s syndrome, she is in control of her mouth/behavior.
I would suggest she read: The Verbally Abusive Relationship by patricia Evans (she will hate this), but it will help her understand her behavior. I would also suggest she get therapy (she will REALLY hate that).
People like her have terrible relationships and are so miserable they have a need to make everyone miserable..
She is excruciatingly INsecure…..people like that are emotional vampires…..they need their “fix” continuously to feel good about themselves, but it is a never ending job for them.
They hate/dislike themselves and take it out on everyone else around them. She is behaving like a spoiled brat….look at me, look at me.
Yes, she is jealous AND insecure. You can confront her in a professional, polite manner and let her know her behavior is unprofessional. you could really confuse her, and say….so, how do you think we could work together in a professional, harmonious way that would benefit both of us?
She will be totally confused. These kinds of people refuse to see their behavior for what it is and will continue to act out….what do we do with children who act out? We ignore them, but since you cannot do that……..I believe it is important to speak to her….you could invite her to lunch (I know, sounds crazy) and talk to her there…….kindness will push her (more ) off-balance.
Well…wow! I am so grateful to all of you who have taken time to help me with this challenge! I’ve learned more from this exchange than I anticipated. Here’s what I’ve learned:
1. I need to broaden my friendship range and stop relying so heavily on people at work to fill a social void. I sometimes work long hours and many of the women in my building with whom I work are around my age. The tendency is, I think for me, to seek friendships where they are most convenient regardless of whether or not we really have much in common. I’ve been trying to be friends with people who are actually quite different than me – different interests and approaches – not wrong mind you – just different. I love fashion, travel, exercise, plays, writing, and learning new things. My kids are grown and I’m ready to explore…whatever.
2. I let D hurt me because I have tried to befriend her and that isn’t possible. How liberating is that! I DON’T HAVE TO BE HER FRIEND! Woohoo!
. What a relief!
3. I can be cordial. Period. That’s it. And professional. Cordial and professional. And if she can’t handle those parameters…not my problem.
4. But here’s what I’ve really gotten out of this exchange – all of these responses were SUPPORTIVE of me. Yes, Lynette said I was a doormat, and that stung just a little because that’s not something I ever considered myself and sure don’t want to be. And, by the way, I thank you for putting that out there, because I know now you were right, but I would never have considered that possibility! Jump-started me, I’ll tell you.
KGrandma…I can’t tell you the last time anyone said I amaze them
. I love my mother dearly, but she always has been quite critical of me – and never in 54 years has she said I amaze her. Not that you’re old enough to be my mother 
BUT, all those words you said in PRINT brought tears to my eyes and I’ve read them over and over.
Alicia…what you say about jealousy is true. Deep down inside I’ve always felt like she is jealous because I am confident and people look to me for leadership. What they don’t know and don’t have to know is that there is a line from a Bruce Springsteen song that says, “I can’t tell my courage from my desperation.”
Sometimes that’s me, but one chink in my armor at work is one chink too many – so I appear to be all together even when sometimes I’m not.
So…I haven’t confronted her because the timing isn’t right, and I may never ever do that. I’m not sure telling her how I feel would matter except to give her a power over me that she doesn’t deserve – the power she has to royally piss me off
.
So, for now…cordial and professional. I haven’t avoided her, but I haven’t gone out of my way to confer with her on decisions, I stopped copying her on emails, AND…I told a couple of people who have come to me to ask me to intervene with her on their behalf (happens all the time) that it would be better if they deal with her directly. It suddenly occured to me when that happened for the second time in a day that maybe I have shouldered other people’s problems with her too…and I’m through with that.
All in all…Vicky has regained much of her Muchness…thanks to you all. I’ll keep you posted! THANK YOU!
Muchness….love it….Yay, you!!
I like this one statement I heard…..that you don’t have to accept every invitation to an argument!
In other words, we choose what and/or IF we respond to someone. You own your own power!
The bottom line is that she is miserable and she wants to drag others into her miserableness!
Congratulations and good for you. You do amaze me, and I have no doubt that you can use all the strength that kept you silent and beaten to now turn it around and be professional and distant, pleasant yet cool. It’s obvious to me, at least, that you can do anything.
I agree mostly with others have stated.
My hesitancy however is in the fact that you state she has the new bosses favor. If she is fawning all over the boss and the boss LIKES her as a result, then the she could take her side in any meltdown between the two of you.
I would yes, slowly change the dynamics of the relationship. For instance, not make her travel arrangements.
(how did that begin anyway? did you offer to do both it or where you place in charge of doing so at one point?)
Of course you will have to notify her you will not being do so.
Perhaps you could email her your arrangements and statel something like; this is MY intineray, I thought to send to you so as when you BOOK YOUR OWN…” or something to that effect.
If you don’t advise her ahead of time that your are no longer making them like a school girl she could run to the principal and exclaim ” Vicki didn’t make my travel arrangements!!! she only made hers!!! she’s trying to sabotage me…”
another thought… if she is so condescending and delusional at shool she’s that way outside work as well.
she may not even be that busy at her church. she may just be fronting. I am sure anywhere she goes folks find her a pain
I myself would not hand her any type book to read but rather read many (can you recieve to counseling?) to empower myself.
Why would I not do so?? Because if you hand her a self improvement book, she may interpret this as confrontational/condescending and run to the principal) with the thought that you are harrassing her!
When she inquires as to how many hours you’ve worked; respond with something vague like “enough to get everything accomplished.”. Write down several different
I would begin to keep a diary of her aggressive, consecdencng behavior.
I would stop defending her but netithe would I join in with others as they criticize her.
Vicki, there are many in society who though functioning, have undiagnosed mental illnesses, she appears to be one.
Empower yourself so as to minimize the effects of her toxic behavior on what is otherwise a stellar career.
WISE WOMAN U R!…TRACK
Update. I don’t hold grudges…but boy am I having a hard time being in the same room with this woman. Since I’ve kept her at arm’s length – professional, but distant, she has REALLY gone for the jugular. So much so that a couple of the secretaries in the office have noticed. One secretary told her supervisor, who I work closely with, “Wow…D sure tried to nail V in that meeting. What’s with her?”
Too much ridiculous crap to even write and the whole thing is just getting very, very boring to me. So, finally, I told my boss. I told him the day I asked him to write me a letter of recommendation for a job I am applying for fifty miles away. He was very nice and said, “Sure. But may I ask why you want to leave?”
So I told him. He had no idea (men). I told him that at this stage of my life I want to be able to produce my best thinking, my best work, and my best self and that I didn’t have the energy nor the inclination to do battle in a situation where no one can win.
He asked me to give him time to correct the situation and he asked me to please stay and not change jobs. He said he depended on me for so much and that he had so much confidence in me that if I left it would be hard to replace me. (Frankly…no one is indispensable…something else I’ve learned and accepted with age.) But it was nice to hear all those things, and it was nice to get it off my chest.
But I still think I’m going to have to have a private conversation with her and here is what I am going to say (unless you all can help me out with this one).
You and I have worked together for eight years. In those eight years we have had professional disagreements and sometimes, because of the nature of how closely we had to work together, our very different personalities have come into play and we have clashed on occasion.
I have tried my best to help you in any way. I have included you in decisions when appropriate, and I have explained other decisions when they had nothing to do with you out of professional courtesy. I think you do a good job and I think you try very hard to make our system better.
I would like to be able to continue that professional relationship with some definite parameters. Here are those parameters:
1. It is not my business to keep track of how many hours you work, when you get to work, or when you leave. You are a professional, and I know you do your job.
By the same token…so do I. It’s not a competetion who can work the most hours. I tend to work quickly and quietly and I accomplish goals well in advance of deadlines because I don’t like the stress of last minute.
You don’t mind that stress and I think you actually like to work long hours. That’s your perogative. But please refrain from making comments about when I get to work or when I leave. I have only one supervisor and he and I have had this conversation and he knows that sometimes I get to work at 6:30 and sometimes I get here at 8:00. Sometimes I leave at 4:30 and sometimes I don’t get out until 6:00 or later – depending on meetings. But at the end of the day – I’m going to the gym and then I’m going home and swim or play with the dog, or visit with friends. And frankly, I resent when you question me about my time. So don’t do that any more.
2. I have a set of goals and a couple of major projects that I’m working on with others in our system. In the past, I’ve tried to include you in everything, but I end up working twice as hard to keep you involved and to fill you in when you’re late to meetings – which you frequently are. I’m not hiding projects from you, but I will not necessarily include you in those projects. You have your own set of goals and projects and if we both work on the same thing – it isn’t productive.
Included in that parameter are the conferences I must attend in order to complete the projects. In the past, I’ve made sure you get where we’re supposed to go, etc. but I won’t do that anymore. If you lose your reservation confirmation or your registrations, I will no longer keep a copy of those in a separate folder for you.
3. Finally, if you continue to make disparaging remarks about me in front of secretaries and others, I will file an official grievance with the board. I have documentation where you have done so. I don’t want to do that, but I will.
And, because we have worked together for so long, I’ll tell you that the breaking point with me was when you were so very unkind to me the day after my friend died. And I didn’t imagine that unkindness, because it was noted by others. You and I are the same age. We’ve both been through divorces in our lives, we’ve raised children to adulthood successfully, we have good jobs, we are healthy, and we have supportive families. I don’t understand women who don’t support other women. I don’t understand why you have felt the need, over the past eight years, to behave as you have. And…I hope I never understand.
Those are my thoughts. We have to work together – and I will work very hard to keep that professional. I expect the same from you.
What do you all think??????
Vicky, I think you’re amazing too! I have just read through the thread about your workplace situation and I am sure that you have taught many people, as you have evolved in a very short time. It is so gratifying to know that you finally were able to speak with your boss about the bully in your office…wait…did she say bully? Yes I sure did…bullying isn’t reserved for the school yard, it is rampant in our society and we need to empower ourselves, so that we can disarm bullies with love.
What you describe above is pretty much perfect and I hope that you will find a way to deliver your “statement of boundaries” in person. It would be so much more effective.
Someone in this conversation said that we tell people how they can treat us, so I am pleased to see you accepting responsibility for taking on the toxic waste this person felt entitled to drop at your door; I am also over the moon for you that you are finished with it.
May I suggest tenderness with yourself about all of it? Maya Angelou says it best: “when we know better, we do better.” Then tenderness for the bully because ultimately what bullies are searching for is love, unfortunately they look in all the wrong places.
Having healthy boundaries is a challenge for some of us however I can speak from personal experience that once we set the boundary in a relationship, there is a feeling of empowerment that flows naturally from knowing our own value. When we know our own value, amazingly new people show up in our lives to reflect back to us all of the beauty and love we are putting out.
Not to get too philosophical…..it’s just how law of attraction works. Thank you for sharing your story and for inspiring us to create healthy boundaries. I’m looking forward to reading about how your meetng goes with D. Bravo!
I have to say I that I absolutely agree with Raffila … none of your long, and rather “nice girl”, explanation will make any difference. Every point can be quickly and very effectivly turned against you, again.
You do not owe her an explanation, the explanation is for your own satisfaction, it will not change anything except perhaps to elicit some more catty remarks that will go to the tenor of “Ohhhh, Vicky has problem and takes it out on poor me!”.
We cannot change people, we only can change ourselves and our approach to others.
I can tell you what I would do … when she comes with her catty remarks, smile like the tiger approaching her prey, sit or stand upright, look her straight in the eyes, and say absolutely nothing. If there are others around that hear her, make eye contact with them, smile and shake your head. Then walk away. Do not allow her to draw you down onto her level, she will beat you there with with sheer experience! Let her and her remarks stand alone in the room.
She will need probably several times of being in that silence, and she will try to provoke, stick to your guns. If you have to absolutely say something wait until you have others around, let her finish what she has to say and then come down on her like a ton of bricks … “Well, that was enlighting to all Dolly! Thank you for sharing such a remarkably professional and qualified opinion!” … smile, let the awkward silence that follows such a sentence stand for a while, and then get on with business as usual.
But that is me.
I think it’s great that you wrote all your thoughts here.. and that your boss was so supportive of you.. Now it’s time to do those things you talked about–making new friends, engaging in activities that are fun outside work–not so dependent on the work place for social life.
Let it go with her, don’t bother to explain. Half of it she won’t understand, the other half will enrage her and cause her to lash out.
She doesn’t need to know that the boss is on your side. That should stay confidential.
I’d continue to smile and be polite to this gal, but leave her alone. Don’t provoke the snake to bite you, she’s done enough harm now.
Vicky,
I have been in this position many times – with both men and women. I have tried everything – from ignoring it and being a bigger person to attacking them like a screaming howler monkey. All of these experiences have taught me much. First you have to realize that she is not jealous of you – she is insecure and trying to throw negative attention on you to keep “them” from looking at her flaws. She thinks that if she throws you under the bus “they” will see that she shines. And she’s too stupid to see that it isn’t working.
The problem is – it’s working against you. Your boss can’t help you, your co-workers can’t help you. Only you can help you and it’s very freakin’ hard!
Here’s my suggestion. Don’t go out of your way to help/include her – but do your job professionally. If your job is making the reservations then make them.
The whole thing boils down to one simple concept – control. Control unilaterally – but especially in public. Whatever you say to her in private will go in one ear and out the other – she has a big problem and she likes an audience.
What you have to do is take control. I have found after many many failed attempts at gaining control that the best way to gain it is to change the dynamic of the situation.
This will require enormous focus and preparation on your part – but it will be AWESOME when you see how it works. Here’s how it goes:
The two of you are in a meeting with ten other people, out of nowhere she says “Vicky has done a particularly disappointing job in schedule our upcoming convention.” All eyes turn to you and you feel obligated to defend yourself – big fat mistake. This is what you do: you take a moment (very pregnant pause) you turn to her and slowly and in a low voice you say “Debbie we are both aware that that was an inappropriate comment to make in this meeting – why don’t you come and see me afterward and we can explore why you’re having more and more of these explosive outbursts.” Then you turn back to the meeting as though the last two comments were never made. All negative thoughts are concentrated directly on Debbie. You haven’t made a fool of yourself – you’ve been the grown up.
You have maintained your professionalism and begun a course of behavior modification in Debbie. If you ignore her comments – she wins, if you yell back – she’s cracked your professional shell and brought you down to her level – she wins again. If you change the subject – it’s not about Vicky’s performance it’s about Debbie’s outbursts – you’re in control.
I have killed with this technique – and I can still look at myself in the mirror afterward because I took the high road!
Good luck – it takes a mind like a steel trap! But I’m guessing you have one!
Hi all- though I am having trouble with the new layout of VN – I still manage to log on and read recents posts though I post rarely. I have clicked on to follow thsi post so will see if I can. The oruginal impossible co worker popped up in my e-mail so I logged on to read that and all the attached wonderful responses. I dont have an impossible co-worke but an impossible husband of almost 28 years 26 married. I am in a situation that will only change when I leave and file for divorce. We seperated for a year and he begged me to come back to help support our 2 daughters in college- we owed them our support and we could do it better together than trying ti maintain seperate house holds. The honey moon period was short lived. The man is an alcoholic, a coward and bully. He has been told he is a case book example of manic depressive (by a counselor) and should seek help. Of course the counselor was “a quack”. I have walked on eggshells my entire marriage but none more than the last 3 years. I can see the storm brewing, and know its going to hit, and do the best I can not to make it any worse just so its over soon. In my face yelling, screaming poking at me- telling me how awful I am-teh C word flying all around..how miserable he is and the problems in his life are all my fault blah blah blah…. I know this is nor way to live and it is not the life I want either- but I still agree to get our kids through college and pay the bills and keep the house we have to di it together. I came back to him in 2008 with no plan other than a financial agreement to contribute 1/2 of the house hold expenses. I have held up that part of the agreement but am also the one who does the christmas shoppin, the birthday shopping, pays back private student loans for one daughter, pays summer college expenses for a second daughter , and do what ever I can financially for the third daughter. I havea good job and am thankful to have it but have not had a raise in four years. My husband was de,oted three years ago (part of the financila reason I came back) and even though he promised it was a temporary situation hasnt done anything to improve his lot-yet blames me for the life he has and the job he has etc. We file a joint tax return so if he wasnt a complete idiot he would see how much money we each make but he prefers to yell and scream that he is carrying all the weight and he is sure I am stashing money away on him. Any way – my point is- that a lot of the answers tp this post have helped me. I am tired of being understanding and not standing up for myself -nt speaking of a confrontation with a crazy person-but rather not looking for the joy in my own life- with out him. Other than my job and my girls I want to focus on what it is that will make me happy- what/who doI want to be when I grow up- what interest do I have that perhaps he has ruined for me in the past – thatI can revive. Yes, the man is a sick f***- also a coward and a bully and I have just had enough. Since I know my future does not include him I amgoing to get really serious and work on the two year plan. Wish me luck ladies.
I’ve been there and done it–same length of time–same story. Make your plan and stick to it. Don’t tip him off, get it all as tight as a drum with a good lawyer.. and get some counseling yourself to be sure you have all bases covered. Then end it.
I am not good with adding a link, but I suggest you google bipolar and look for an article in Pyschology Today. It quotes statistics on bipolar disease that are not cheering and are honest. INcluding the divorce rate-80 percent, how long it takes to be diagnosed on average –20 year! and the percentage of substance abusers (ie his drinking)
also way above national average. This is a no-win situation for you.
Get out while you still have your own sanity. Dealing daily with the person who won’t take responsilbity for the consequences of their illness, won’t attempt to find help and meds–tends to do terrible damage to the spouse–Keep up your courage and Get Out. All best wishes and big hugs.
Hey Vicky: Everyone here has offered sound advice, and you obviously are doing a good job of listening and learning. So I don’t have a lot to add. I would only make these points, which affirm what others already have said:
* Forget the heart-to-heart conversation. She isn’t going to listen and you aren’t going to change her. Plus you run the risk of it escalating and you saying something you might regret. As others have said: Be distant and professional and stop doing things (like arranging her travel) that she should have done herself. If she asks why, don’t go into an explanation about her behavior. Just say: “I am too busy with my own work now, sorry.” That’s the professional answer.
* Understand it’s not about you. This woman has emotional problems. You just happen to be the latest target. Trust me, there have been others.
* Keep a record of her abusive behavior, if you think that might become an issue with the new boss. But be cautious about filing a grievance. Once you put it in writing, it kicks it up a notch and you can get caught in the cross fire. I’ve seen it happen.
If you like your job, I would concentrate on outlasting her. You probably will, given you have a good track record at work and she seems to be a train wreck.
* And I do think you should ask yourself, as I think you have been doing, what is it about yourself that made you continue to try to fix this situation, and this person, when it was so clearly one-sided and unsucessful. I think “doormat” is a little harsh. But perhaps you are a person who needs peace and acceptance above all else, which can bring you problems in the workplace.
I do feel for you. I had a similar problem with a co-worker, who viewed me as competition and a threat. I tried everything to be nice to her: took her lunch, asked about her kids, gave her extra projects that I wanted to do myself, etc. In the end, she got laid off anyway — and then told everyone it was because of me, that I undermined her. Truth was, as everyone said after she was gone, she was a be-yatch that did sloppy work and was impossible to deal with on top of it.
Be strong, girl. Some day, this all will be behind you.
Hi Vicki;
You do sound like a great friend and a valuable co-worker and professional contribution to your company. I have been in these situations myself and I can identify with how you’ve been feeling so well…and how you’ve been handling it. All this advice is so wonderful and supportive and you(we) are so lucky to have such amazing women around us.
KGrandma – wow…. do you want to be my Mom? ;~) What wonderful, peaceful viewpoints.
Loved the quote ““I can’t tell my courage from my desperation.” It made my reflect.
I agree that your letter will not help and will tend to exacerbate the situation. Having it written down for her will also give her the opportunity to reflect back on it many times in future and get increasingly hostile.
The advice you been given otherwise about being courteous but distant and professional is the best. And I would follow the advice given to call her calmly on her unprofessionalism in public where it’s needed.
I have been here… she is a very sensitive person, like a cat stalking prey, she picks up on every single cue that will work to her emotional advantages… its her survival instinct. She will notice the very subtlest of your changes in behaviour and although, it seems childish and crazy, I think its very likely that she really respects and likes you, and admires you …. hence her focus on you in particular. As soon as the behaviour dynamic changes, she will begin to feel alone and confused because planning her strategies around this has filled up her time. She is likely then to seek your friendship and forgiveness. Be very careful not to be drawn in again.
believe although you have suffered for 8 years, it will take very little to make a world of difference in the dynamic. That’s my experience. If you really feel done with it, deep down, and you feel confident, and you are filling yourself with happiness and support from other areas in your life, it will show on your face and in your body language (watch that body language, its everything). When she can no longer sucessfully push your “caregiver” buttons, and see the hurt you feel when she questions your professional integrity, it will not give her the bang for her buck that she craves and she will quit. And my guess is that she will begin to really miss the kindness and support you’ve always given her. However, stay the course and don’t fall bait to any new strategies to win you over again. You’ve suffered long enough and you owe her nothing.
Hopefully, someone else will not fall victim when she scans the room for another outlet. Its good that you told your boss and that other co-workers are aware. Someone should suggest a workshop that everyone including her can attend to increase team values and support, mutual respect and positive work relationships… may be suggest this to the boss. This is bound to put all that previous negative behaviour all out there on the table for her to take ownership of. Maybe that will really help her too and that would be a good thing.
Best wishes to you.
Vicky,
I feel for you! I also in education and had something very similar happen with a coworker last year.
I realized (for myself) if I had put up with this behavior from a family member I would have been “codependent”, and putting up with abuse. So why was I allowing this from a non-family member, who I really had no personal feelings for? I just did a random internet search for “enabling” and “codependence”, and got some good tips on how to deal with passive-agressive people, such as my (and your) coworker.
It is all over now, once she lost my support she fell on her face and lost her department chair position, and it was only partially because once I started backing off from “enabling” her and allowing her bad behavior, she pretty much lost respect from everyone, because I was known as one of the sweetest people in the school and for me to be treated that way was uncalled for.
Another thing I did was join a teacher’s union for legal support. I did not know whose ear she had, it’s very uncomfortable not know exactly was these nuts are up to, and I was really afraid someone with the power to influence MY job was listening to her craziness and believing it.
I’m not a big union person, but I once belonged to one early in my career when I had recess duty in elementary, and it was for legal representation in case something terrible happened to a child under my watch and I was sued personally. This time when I joined, I let it out through the grapevine that I joined a union for legal representation in case I experienced harrassment or bullying, and at the same time her abuse toward me stopped. Don’t know if that’s why because I have very little to do with her any more, and when I do it’s very pleasant and professional. Period!
Just a suggestion for the next time your co-worker drops one of her unpleasant criticisms of you in front of others. Be prepared for it.
When it comes, roll your eyes, smile cheerfully and say, “I believe we were discussing..” and name the topic just before her comment. Then turn to someone lively in the group and ask a neutral question of them.
Example: You were talking about an upcoming seminar… ask the other person if she’s stayed in the hotel before.. and is it comfortable.. or ask if what restaurant she likes in the city.
If it helps, consider her outbursts to be the equivelant of a fart. Treat the same. Ignore and move along. It makes the others more comfortable if you show no distress. If she gets no attention on the outbursts, she may stop them.
This technique won’t work unless you take a few minutes to roleplay by yourself at home–to be prepared for the next time. Because you know there will be one. If you’re ready, it won’t catch you off guard, won’t provoke a feeling of defensiveness in you.
I like Billi’s answer so much because it puts the emphasis on you–controlling yourself, not trying to control the co-worker. And Billi’s so right–if you can let go of your own hurt feelings and unhappiness, it will show in your body language–you will Feel ok and no longer let her harm you. You can chose how you feel, you cannot chose how she behaves.
Been There. Not any more.
YEAH!
Had to change.
I’m on a road of happiness!
Joy is a weapon that can’t be beat!
I have much more to offer now that I don’t settle for less of myself.
Life is wonderfully short.
Lotta people to thank along the way.
Thanks for sharing Vicki.
Thanks to Everybody else too.
Have a great day!
I’ll do the same! ;-j
Yes, Vicky I had a very similar situation. I knew the woman had a very belittling father and some “childhood damage” so i always complimented her, used humor in our interactions, and included her like you, blah, blah, blah. One day after 2 years she (as always) criticized my work and said she had to “fix” something I did. I got very quiet – i wanted to go into the computer “history” to see if that was true (if indeed i made an error). well i checked and it was a complete lie – just a ploy to make other people feel less than they are.
Long story short – I went to the boss said i am “done” and i cannot work like this any longer bye! Well, lucky for me, another boss overheard me and came running from his office and said i want you to work in my department and get away from that woman. So i am in a new department and have never spoken to that woman again. Ah, freedom is wonderful, now i notice she has found another dog to kick around.
I am a therapist, and I teach my clients strategies for dealing with the difficult people in their lives. In this case, you might try what I call “The Truth Message.” In order to do this, you filter through all the words this woman has said until you hear something that is actually true. Even if it is an unpleasant truth. Then you very calmly agree with the truth. This teaches other people to become truth-tellers, and it teaches you to pay attention only to the truth. If you do this for two years, moment by moment with this woman, you will see positive changes in yourself over time. Thus you can stop feeling that she is succeeding in doing harm to you and your reputation at work. Hope this helps.
Actually, your co-worker sounds like an insecure bully that is looking to toot her own horn. personally, I don’t cotton to anyone who is not a true feminist that is supportive of other women in the workplace. I think I’d invite her to lunch (I know that would not be pleasant) and as you’re eating, tell her that you are concerned about the direction her attitude has taken toward you, with her abruptness and that you will no longer tolerate her unwarranted disrespect and antagonism. You know, harassment is not perpetrated solely by men these days. Her arrogance is stifling and petulant and needs to be curbed so that she doesn’t come off as some kind of unprofessional screwball and you felt it would be better to address the issue directly with her rather than with the boss and personnel dept. But, if she doesn’t stop acting like the office prima donna, you will bring it the attention of the appropriate supervisor. Kapish?
Well thank you all so very, very much for taking time to help me think this through! I never had the heart to heart. I never wrote her an email. I just decided to avoid her and focus my attention completely on my job and the positive things I can do there.
AND…I stopped bringing her home with me if you know what I mean. I created an invisible line on my way home from work, and when I cross that line, I refuse to think about work. I turn my attention to home and away from work. Part of my challenge has been that in fight or flight…I almost always fight, but I never thought this was appropriate in the work place and I bothered me that I couldn’t quite get a grip on how to rip her hair out of her head without seeming unprofessional
. Sorry…not very enlightened, but true. And, OF COURSE, I would never act on any kind of frustrated feelings like that.
So…here’s the latest in my saga. We’ve been in a crisis situation at work, and I have had to work very closely with the boss and our financial officer to try to solve some major problems. We have worked together very well and have saved some jobs. Through that process I have gained a greater respect for my boss and he, in turn, has expressed confidence in my ability and more importantly in my willingness to work in a team for the greater good.
Now she tries to sit next to me at meetings, has publicly complimented me (in front of the boss) and has tried everything she can to get back in good graces. I’m cordial and professional, but not going back there with her. So this situation really is working itself out – but it did me wonders of good to be able to express myself on this site and it was so gratifying to have the support of other women.
Thank you all so much for taking time for me. In the middle of all this…my husband and I separated. I can see where I had become so exhausted and lost by what was going on at work that I couldn’t deal with what had become of my marriage.
So…it’s a new day. I am so peaceful at home – and you can’t put a price on peace. I’m productive at work and that’s getting better – and you can’t put a price on that. AND…I’ll be 55 this month, so I get a senior discount
.
This is exactly what I needed to read today. I’m glad things worked out for you. Thank you for the update and for letting me learn from your experiences. You can’t pay for this kind of wisdom. Blessings to you in the days to come.
I so appreciate the update and am so glad for your renewed sense of self. The senior discounts can’t hurt, either! ♥
Personally, I would not have been so nice. I think I would have taken a copy of your initial post that layed out the situation and had it delivered by certified mail (so that your boss had to acknowledge acceptable that he received the letter, in case there was a bigger issue down the road). He would have read also how your co-workers felt about this employee, and that it wasn’t just a case of a disgruntled or difficult co-worker issue. However, in the end, your way was better suited to your purpose. My question is, is this employee a union employee? I’m surprised she still works in your field. She is a shamer who lets others do her work and obviously has a bad attitude in a working environment and with other co-workers. She will not be promoted or respected.