A while back I received the following e-mail from Daily OM, an inspirational website. Having run across the phrase ‘the haves vs the have-nots’ often on VN posts, as well as other implications of class warfare, I thought I would share the following for your consideration:
November 30, 2009
An Instrument of Change
Wealth Is Neutral
At its most basic, money is a tool that enables us to meet our individual needs. As a form of potential energy that empowers us to generate change, it is neither good nor bad. Yet many people react emotionally to issues concerning finances, unconsciously condemning currency itself, the manner in which money is spent, and people who live lives of financial abundance. Individuals who are rich in gifts such as high intelligence are acknowledged for their positive traits while those who have acquired material riches or aspire to become wealthy are frequently judged harshly. However, wealth is not a trait upon which judgment can be legitimately passed. It tells us nothing about how a person lives, what they believe in, whom they care for, or the scope of their values. Like any blessing, wealth is merely an instrument of purpose that can be used both constructively and destructively.
From an early age, people learn to court wealth while simultaneously associating money with greed, selfishness, and unethical behavior. Consequently, this idea becomes entrenched in their hearts as envy. To attain a balanced and rational comprehension of money, as well as a fairer perspective of wealth, we need to recognize that outward manifestations of wealth tell us little about the individuals enjoying those blessings. When we feel the finger of jealousy prompting us to draw unflattering conclusions about people whose lives seem more financially secure than our own, we should remind ourselves that there are many elements of their circumstances we cannot see. Their wealth may be the result of long hours of taxing labor, they may donate a large percentage of their resources to charitable causes, or their bounty may be an incidental aspect of a life spent doing what they love. Ultimately, we can heal our hurtful associations with money by turning a blind eye toward both wea! lth and poverty when interacting with others and instead focusing on the individual before us.
If you take a moment to consider you own feelings regarding money and wealth, you may discover that you equate financial prosperity with happiness, power, security, independence, or self-indulgence. Money itself, however, is none of these things. You can begin developing a healthier view of wealth by simply accepting that while some possess great wealth and others do not, we all have the potential to create lives of beauty, substance, and wisdom using the resources we have been granted.
thank you so much Lisa, that helps a lot. I know he tried to blame me for so much stuff, but like I told all of his family and mine none of that added up to a divorce. I do realize it's his needs, it just hurts so bad to think how many years he's
How funny....i only very recently (within last week) read the coconut oil articles on the web. (100 uses, 80 uses etc.) so i bouht some and ordered some from amazon. (Im a stockpiler.)
Have started trying some of the uses. I tried using it a
Just ask Tiger Woods if wealth and power brought him happiness.
or Michael Jackson, but it surely will make me content. I do not need much, just enough to pay my house in full, the car, and have a few thousand in the bank after that, so i do not have to worry for a while.
“Money doesn’t buy happiness……but it can buy some remarkable substitutes.”
–Rhett Butler
Ok with that out of the way I’ve thought a lot about this. If you are successful and have wealth (however you define it)–you think you earned it. If you aren’t–you think you’ve been screwed, and that lucky SOB took it away from you.
Neither is right, neither is wrong, the truth is often in the middle…and what is..well it IS.
I make more money than most…meaning I make more than the average. I worked my way up from the bottom. I’m not wealthy by Bill Gates standards, I have much more than the average person in the USA. I’m not going to be specific, but I’m not worth millions, but i’ll never starve .
I earned every freaking dime of it, I inherited nothing, and nothing was “given” to me, but I was lucky–no doubt. Lots of right place, right time. But I could have screwed it up, and I didn’t screw it up, and I keep it up. I worked hard. I lost husbands, I only had 1 child (would have loved more) but yes I chased after career.
I’m done. I dont need more than 1 home, I dont need the vacation home, I dont need all the acoutrements. I have ENOUGH. ENOUGH is a beautiful place.
“I wish you enough sun to keep your attitude bright no matter how gray the day. Enough happiness to keep your spirit alive. Enough pain so joys appear bigger. Enough gain to satisfy your wanting. Enough loss to appreciate all that you possess. Enough hellos to get you through the good-byes. To everyone -… I wish you enough in the coming new year and beyond.”
That said–keep your hands out of my pocket. Dont’ deny me what I have. And don’t try and make me feel guilty for having more than……….insert noun here.
Sorry. That’s how I feel.
Actually, no I’m not sorry. It is how I feel. I own it. All of it.
I admire and salute you for your openness and honesty Dallas Lady and you should never fell guilty about what you have-its a part of who you are and you earned it. Your quotes are wonderful and very poignant.
I feel that wealth is incredibly subjective. As you explained in your post, people really view it from many different perspectives and come to very different conclusions-neither is right, neither is wrong.
One example: I grew up in a working class family-we had enough, went camping for vacations; my husband grew up in a barrio with 8 siblings and not a lot of extras in life-like a Christmas gift, never a vacation. I was the only one in my family to go to college- a state school that I paid for and got a job in Silicon Valley after that and supported myself. My husband worked his a-s off, went to Texas A &M and went into the Navy as a pilot in Viet Nam, thinking that was the only way to stay alive. I met him when I was 26 working in the Valley and he was a reserve pilot based close to my workplace. He was also a commercial pilot and worked his days off in a part-time corporate position. We got married, he had three jobs, I was working and got pregnant-realized my kids were never going to see their Dad too much and so I quit working and raised two daughters-the extra $ I earned meant nothing to me at that point-it had meant a hell of a lot before, when I was single. Later I decided to work as a realtor when they were older-my choice. My point is-that to my husband you can never have enough $ in the bank. I like the security of $ in the bank and I know what I need for the rest of my life, and am fortunate enough to have a hard working successful husband. We just view $ differently. I’ve had a very comfortable life style and would have done just fine if I had never married. Luckily we both never wanted to indulge our daughters with things, but preferred experiences-summer camp, good schools, etc-we agreed on one thing. I think one’s background can really influence the way they view $.
You’re so right ENOUGH is a beautiful place-I agree. But enough is subjective too, to a lot of people in the world you are extremely wealthy. But I’m sure you would agree that wealth denotes so much more than the number in the bank account. It’s many things-having healthy children, to me, is wealth.
At this point in my life, I feel I need to give back and my husband will agree with me if it’s donating his time, NOT his $. I used to abide by this “rule” of his, but stopped doing that years ago. I was in San Francisco one Christmas season and a man was holding a sign saying “Viet Nam Vet, need $ to buy my kids Christmas presents. I opened my wallet, had 2 20′s and a 10 and gave him the two 20′s- (not too generous, had to save some for me). I told my husband when I saw him next and he blew up. ”If he was a Vet he’d be working at McDonald’s, he’s a druggie.” One of the biggest fights of our marriage-almost ended it. I continued to do what I wanted-just in case-what if the man didn’t have $ for presents?? My husband had woken up on Christmas morning to nothing and that broke my heart. (Although, my parents would have made a paper doll and wrapped it in newspaper)
With such different views on this subject -It’s a miracle that we are still married after 30 years!!!
Your mileage may vary.
Good for you! You have worked hard and deserve to own a nice home, car, etc. That’s what makes this country so great, and hopefully that never changes.
That’s great. There’s already too many poor people. I’m glad you’re doing fine.
Money is only the means to an end. Some worship wealth, some aspire to be wealthy, some will never be happy with what they have and some will never have any. People judge you by your wealth. Some flaunt it and some are afraid to spend it. Some don’t know how to hang onto it. It takes all kinds in this world.
Here’s a thought; If all the money was divided equally, inside of an hr, 90% of it would belong to 10% of the people.
Your last sentence is a good argument against redistributive policies.
It’s an old wives tale or old husbands tale. I’ve heard this for years. It’s about as provable as the number of jobs saved through the “spendulas bills”.
LOL!
I just listened to Glen Beck, keynote speaker at CPAC, Washington.
“We are all created equal but we do not end up the same through our life choices.”
I totally agree. He could well represent the Tea Party, unless he sells his sole like other politicians.
He is already a very, very well paid TV media pundit on FOX network. He’d have to take a pay cut to become a politician…..and he is all about the $$$$. He used to be a very pudgy radio jock but got a chance to go Cable and lost 30 pounds and never looked back……that is the true meaning of his Created equal but do not end up that same through our life choices……he sold his SOUL to the highest bidder….
Watch at touch more NPR AND CNN AND MSNBC to get a bit of balance in your life…..just a suggestion….
How can listening to the far left broadcasting balance anything? Maybe CNN but the MSNBC has no credibility.
Simple. Listening to far-left broadcasting balances out the far-right broadcasting. She’s not saying to stop watching FOX. Just watch some others for different points of view and different presentation angles. Also read more than one newspaper and visit far left and far right web sites. Maybe visit factcheck.org every once in a while and do check up on the Daily Show and Colbert Report (there’s a lot of truth in satire). When you do that, you get a better picture of what’s really going on. In the process, you’ll find out that Mr Beck is, to put it nicely, very often incoherent or illogical. So, yes, he’d make a great politician.
I like how they present the contradictions in the way senators/reps vote depending now that the Dems are in power – or some of the Dems -Blanche Lincoln- as soon as they got an insurance cos. handout. They actually show videos of those people saying the opposite of something they previously and vehemently supported. I’ve also found interesting the videos of 2 senators speaking forcefully in support of some point, but then the camera panned out and it showed how they were by themselves in the Senate, just putting on a show for Fox
What do you mean he’s all about the money? He’s also a recovering alcoholic whose mother committed suicide and a devout Mormon. He has a special needs child. He’s very up front about this stuff. Sounds like he made decisions to help him succeed. Not sure why you say he sold his soul. Just because he makes money at what he does? To me selling your soul means you give up your principles and values.
I would suggest to you that if those three news outlets are what you watch, then you need balance as well.
I am with you Olga. Sorry ladies, I misspelled “soul”. I just noticed it. I should check my spelling more carefully.
Know what you mean. Roll instead of role is one of mine ;^)
Money and fame affects people differently and you never know until you have it. It’s not the money, it’s the love of money that makes it powerful to an individual. Some relate money to superiority, brains, entitlement and many others. Just too darned early to think of them right now. But I will.
Glenn Beck is upfront about the fact he has made decisions in order to make money. The loss of the 30 pounds of the weight was mentioned on air.
I encourage everyone to work for more balance in viewing and reading habits because modern media is owned (and makes big bucks) by catering to a targeted audience. It’s all about making money nowadays. They don’t care what viewers or readers think, they care about how the stock market sees them and the stockholders meetings.
And to be very, very clear, Olga, I regularly watch all the news channels and compare the info I hear on each and draw my own conclusions. FOX is the most manipulative I’ve watched – they claim to be FAIR AND BALANCED but they are anything BUT. Only zealots would watch this network and believe they are getting the full story and don’t need to compare notes.
My grandfather wanted to teach his heirs only one lesson – to compare notes, read between the lines and come to conclusions that represent your own beliefs, not swallow whole the teaching of just one philosophy.
I am a progressive, not a Democrat. I want health care reform for all. I want insurance companies to have some competition from nonprofit entities. I want my government to protect me from exploitation by corporates who don’t care who they hurt in the pursuit of profit. I am so NOT in favor of small government – that would mean we would be slaves to corporates. If I have to choose between one or other other (thank god I don’t) I would trust that citizens can impact their government more readily than they can a faceless, nameless (no one individual is accountable) corporation.
thanks for the post. I want to read again tomorrow (good glasses left elsewhere). I am presently wondering does anyone feel like reporters on the Fox New Channel yell at you. If I wanted to be spoken to in a loud aggresive manner I would have stayed with my first husband. Love & LIght, Marj
So, because he lost 30lbs for money once, that means he’s all about the money or that he sold his soul? I don’t get it, sorry.
I am glad that you get your news from various sources. I do the same myself, although I prefer written to spoken. I find it more in depth and I’m not distracted by the anchors. However, I do not feel that my doing this gives me the right to judge anyone else as a zealot, or some other form inferior to myself simply for their choice, in a free country, of where to get the news.
As for your point on not wanting less government. I beg to differ on your point that citizens impact their government more readily than they can a corporation, especially since you say you are a progressive. I have read on u-s-history.com and on wikipedia that one of the beliefs of progressivism is that government is best run by trained administrators (bureaucrats), with authority centralized in those offices rather than the elected officials. Having worked for a state government agency for 30 years, I will tell you that many of those administrators wield much power, and are virtually impossible to remove since they are very protected by civil service policies. What ends up happening is that incompetent people are transferred from one dept. to another and demoralizing the employees that are actually competent.
I would also disagree that corporations are nameless and faceless and that no one is accountable. Corporations are not beings. They are legal entities made up of individual people. Corporations have officers and boards of directors. People can be fired on the spot. Government bureaucracies are notoriously innefficient and unresponsive.
I would be interested in discussing the theme of ‘slaves to corporates’ that you mention, but I’m not sure what you mean by that.
One more point. I know that recently Glen Beck has been running a series on progressivism in America. Could this be part of your dislike for him? Just asking……….
Government is irrelevant and unncessary. Glenn Beck said so himself: “Read and educate yourselves, you can do it for free at the Library”
LOL. One of my favorite Beck idioquotes.
From a recent posting at a Labor Union site that demos the Other Side of the Glenn Beck story………..
Glenn Beck is not just crazy, he’s dangerous.
This is a man who thinks President Obama is a racist and fantasized about poisoning the first female Speaker of the House, Nancy Pelosi.
One minute he will cry – literally – about how Barack Obama and SEIU are destroying the country, and the next minute air commercials pitching “survival seeds” as an antidote to coming “economic meltdown.”
He’s nuts. And the only thing he really believes in is conspiracy and selling fear.
That’s why it’s so critical you stand in solidarity with other progressives he’s attacked, join the thousands who have already put their name on “Beck’s blackboard” and share this video with your friends. If you’ve seen his show before, you’ll appreciate it even more.
http://beck.cnnbcvideo.com
Thanks for fighting back against those who wake up daily thinking about how to silence working Americans.
I’m not whining, Olga, I’m shouting. He is crazy and in media only for the MONEY – to be huge and powerful on the measure of his voice alone! It is all about making a lot of money. He is part of the Evil Rich! And your ‘I was a poor cuban immigrant who made good.’ story covers a long history of the haves of Cuba driving the Have nots to revolt. There was an opportunity for Castro ONLY because the landowners of Cuba repressed the peasants (which is what your great great grandparents called the ‘poor’. Think of me as the great great grandchild of one of the ‘poor’ come to hold your feet to the fire! I walked away from this posting because I knew you couldn’t be influenced but I come back to say YOU ARE ENTITLED TO YOUR OPINION, BUT THE FACTS ARE THE FACTS! You won’t shout us down with your higher than mighty superiority ’tude.
I’m progressive because it gives everyone a shot at the brass ring! I wouldn’t consider getting any real information from Glenn Beck – he works on the network that is about infotainment with a political slant.
Yell about Glen Beck all you want. He’s never been accused of physically assaulting others to my knowledge.
I scream about ANdy Stern and the SEIU (and their buddies ACORN). THe last people on earth I would get my opinions from.
More about their antics including personal violence can be found here:
http://www.purplepeoplebeaters.com/?p=692
of course you must be referring to PMS-NBC! I can do an occasional dose of NPR or CNN, but have more respect for my self than subjecting it to the poison vitriol espoused by Keith Olberman and Rachel Maddow and the rest of the shrill left wing team whiners at PMSNBC!
If we were really created equal we would all have very high IQs and there would be no birth defects and mentally deficient people. All who do not become wealthy did not make the wrong choice.
and Marie Antoinette said “Let them eat cake!”
I forget what Jesus said…something about doing to the lesser of us…compassion…
whatever! some of us just don’t know any better.
Just going back and reading through this thread. Marie did not say “Let them eat cake”, or anything of that nature – at least in public. She was a champion of the poor, and donated a portion of her discretionary funds to them. She was incorrectly blamed for the economic downfall of France. Most historians attribute the statement to Marie Therese, wife of Louis XIV, around a hundred years earlier. While she did struggle with a gambling habit, and was caught up in the extravegance of royalty at the time, Marie was definitely not one of the “Evil Rich”.
Ok, change that to Marie whatever. All of us are part of the machinery of our times and they were both victims/beneficiaries of the privileges of nobility in those days. I imagine that a quote like that falls into the category of urban myth and hard to really pin it on to somebody since it was probably uttered in the privacy of their homepalacecastle – however, it was probably their attitude , as seen from the point of view of the p.o.’d peasantry, and the company they kept, that spelled out “let them eat cake” and paved her way to the guillotine. Although she’d shown kindness and generosity to the people when she matured, she was never able to change the image of arrogance and frivolity that she acquired in her early years as princess and queen of France and was blamed for the economic woes of France – inherited from the previous king. Alas, much as it’s happening now!
I don’t think she was ever blamed for the economic downfall of France- but she was part of the ruling elite.
Or to Leona Helmsey “taxes are for the little people”
Hello
I am in Canada. It started in the late 70′s, small business was disappearing and large superpowers were being formed. These superpowers wanted to make instant millions, and they did. Middle class has almost vanished, this is what brought us to this state of economy. Without re-building the middle class our economy will not recover.
Minimum wage, what is it and how do we come up with it. If you earn a minimum wage here in Canada, you can not afford to rent even a small bachelor apartment. A room where you share all other amenities is what you can afford.
It is not the wealth of others that the poor object to, it is how they earn this. And yes it is off the backs of the poor. Thanks to shows like The Secret Millionaire and that other show where a ceo goes incognito to work at low level positions are wonderful. I was watching this one show, where this father was planning his son’s bharmitzwah, he wanted to let a hundred doves go fly indoors, his comment was they are just doves so why not. He could not figure out that these birds would be flying into people, pooping on their food and so on….. I had to change the channel. It is people like him that give the term “more money than brains”.
I volunteered with Girl Guides, every year we went out to collect for the food bank. Large homes, never gave, we hear them say they did not believe in it. Modest homes were the ones who gave. In other words the middle class. And yes you will say the rich donate to charities, of course they do it is a tax shelter. They don’t seem to get it that if they pay their employees better, their business will do better, they will in turn increase buying power.
No, I am not anti wealth. I am against greed. Greed is a mentality, it is the world we live in. For our survival we must increase the middle class, and this starts with the wealthy, pay your employees better and see how our economy will prosper.
To sum it all up; Brittany Spears is a millionaire.
So no wealth does not guarantee happiness, but what you do with it will.
This is wonderful. The same shrinking middle class is happening here. Revolutions never come from the wealthy nor does a change of any kind to improve the masses. Why should it, the wealthy are happy with things like they are. Greed is with all of them but some are much more so than others and have a very high opinion of their own worth. Bonus money paid is one the really burns me.
The best, more complete comment here. Thank you.
Hi Tundi
Just a thought or two.
There is definitely a gap that continues to widen. It’s not all just superpowers that are causing it. Unemployment and governmental regulations and taxation of superpowers can own a major part of that. Not sure exactly what you mean by superpowers. Large corporations? The companies who employ us and pay the bulk of taxes? The employees paying their share too. I’m sure they would rather pay taxes than be on the receiving end of unemployment benefits. Big Corporations are being “demonized” and it’s some what puzzling to me. Businesses need to profit and grow. I don’t even think it’s wrong for the CEO’s of these companies to receive huge pay checks and bonuses. Unless they are being supported by the Government in any way like stimulus money. Then, they should shot the *******s. In this day of cybor news, we are aware of the all mighty dollar without the knowledge of how it works. Example: Stock market. We all own a part of big business if we have a 401K. Money invested with the sole purpose of gaining profit. It just seems removed because we aren’t tapped in directly. It’s to everyone’s advantage when big business are encouraged by our govt.s to stay and employee on our soil. And yes, yes, yes, to profit. To employee people without unions, who have no other purpose than to line their own pockets. They are passe. There are regulations in place to meet the workplace standards that are sometimes superior to what unions do and charge for. Ask anyone who would rather work than do a stint on a picket line. Without pay.
Minimum wage is another thing that is hindering and widening the gap. Every time we raise the minumum age, jobs are lost. It doesn’t help, it hurts because business is faced with losing employees they now cannot afford, The market sets the value. Forced wages is more problematic.
An interesting thing is happening in our small community. When we had the last min. wage increase, many college, elderly and HS students lost their jobs or had their hrs cut. Remember, they are usually the ones who make min. wage. Restaurants and store staff. With the economy the way it is, putting that burden on already suffering entities, only forced layoffs. The city is lowering the wage limit in order for business to rehire and thus stimulating the economy. The basic problem with taking from companies by taxing and regulating wages makes it harder on people in general. Having a job is better than not. The market drives the wages. Most companies don’t pay min. wage. Big business pays more than the min wage but when it goes up, it also effects big corps. as well. It’s a numbers game with them. With the object being: make money and grow. I don’t see anything wrong with that.
We don’t know who gives and doesn’t give. You recognized that but you don’t know. Isn’t it great that there are tax shelters? It’s ok for them to give but not receive anything for it? And, we don’t know, are they major employers provided business for people to earn a living from and feed their families? They don’t owe you anything. I will agree that greed is a problem. From the beginning of time.
Hello
Totally agree with you, but realistically who has more power, the unemployed or large corporations.
Once it is in our pockets we really don’t want to give it up. I think if we step back a little bit and look at our extravagances and what we feel is our entitlement, just maybe we can create a better world.
To elaborate on that story I had about the rich not giving as freely as the middle class, many people were outright rude, and to top it all, in Church this one particular family who pretty much owned half the town was bragging that he went to four different food banks and got free food. That is what I call greed, and it is what it is. But I still volunteer and like to help out in my community. There are those who have never worked a day in their life and expect and demand support.
I don’t take it for granted and do realize it is better to have than to have NOT.
do you agree?
tin
Hi,
What part of Canada are you in? My son and his family live in Calgary. I love your country..
Absolutely, I agree with you.
There are certainly people out there who give rich a bad name. But that is only on the surface. Those people should be ashamed and those who know them are only thinking how small they are so it’s going to backfire on them if it hasn’t already.
Large corporations are owned by people. Working people. People who employ other people. I think it’s better to see what they are and not see them as a single item. They are run by people and stockholders who demand profits or they go somewhere else and offshore begins to look really good. That’s why we need to keep them here.
MG
Would you agree with that?
Hi Tundi,
I was thinking on how to reply to your first post, but then MG beat me to it and said a lot of what I wanted to say, so I won’t repeat.
One of my reasons for starting this post was that I don’t think it’s good for a society when entire groups of people are villified for simply having money. More recently in our country, our politicians have been fueling and adding to that villification by calling people ‘fat cats’ and talking about people getting their ‘piece of the pie’. To me, this attitude encourages envy and class warfare. And that is a tool with which people are kept divided and unhappy. Leaders should be about uniting, not dividing.
I am originally from a communist country, and the fueling of class warfare and envy is one of the methods by which that type government gains power. I try really hard to not let my expeiences cloud my judgement, but there are times when certain phrases and actions by gov’t push certain buttons in me. That’s not necessarily a bad thing, since it keeps me from becoming complacent and deluding myself into believing that totalitarian government could never happen in this country.
As for those people in large homes that you said didn’t give. Did you consider that maybe they’ve mortgaged and charged themselves up the wazoo? Maybe you asking for donations reminded them of how close they were getting to being in a bad position themselves? Outward appearances can be fooling.
Thanks for responding and participating in a good exchange.
Hello Olga and Moongoddess
I too am from a communist background. Hungary. a long time ago.
I am in Toronto, Canada. I love living on this continent, and the relationship with the US.
To answer to you Olga, I wish I could make that excuse that those people were mortgaged to the wazoo, but no they were not. This was in a small community where you knew everyone so it was more personal. I only lasted 6 years there and then moved back to the city, small towns scare me now. But you do learn a lot, I had many good experiences, but the bad out weighted the good sorry to say. My car was stolen right out from the driveway, the attitude you have I will take flourished there, the final straw was when they stole my motorcycle, that I was saving for my kids to learn on when they got old enough it had sentimental value, it was the bike I learned on.
One thing that this experience has taught me is that many people focus too much on the ones who are on assistance, and have been on assistance all their lives, and have the entitlement attitude. That is what I mean about stepping back and looking at a greater picture. The majority of our population is good, they have dreams don’t shy away from a good days work and have the dream. My comment about minimum wage does make sense, businesses who pay even just a little bit more get a lot more respect from their employees, it really works. Remember I do not want to offend anyone, but sometimes being blunt hurts.
So yes I stepped back I mean really, how many cars can you drive at one time.
thxs for your ears.
And that is what caused the recent economic downturn. Look closely at the problems and see what could be different.
God bless, J
It would be nice if we could blame one entity for all of the woes but it’s combination fo many things. What specifically are you talking about? Corporations? If you think they are a problem, wait until you see what owning GM will be like. The Govt. has no business in owning a business that is in direct competition with other like business’s. What’s next? Government owned banks? Can’t wait to see this one play out. It makes me nervous. Hopefully there is a plan in the making to turn that around. GM should have been allowed to fail. That is the natural evolution and bypassing that by treating the symptoms only delays the inevitable. There is a natural selection that takes place. Let’s blame the unions for some of it’s failure. What do you think?
I think part of their failure were the exorbitant health care premiums that are affecting all businesses…and yes, they made some cruddy decisions. The government is trying to avoid a depression with all these economic measures that with more or less success they’re implementing…so far it’s still a recession. Considering what the current Admn. got saddled with upon coming into office -namely the collapse of the financial sector, the largest deficit in history and 2 ongoing wars – with Iraq’s being a war of choice, I think they deserve a bit of a chance and a bit more patience.
That doesn’t mean we shouldn’t question actions we feel will not be good for the country or are contrary to our constitution.
Not at all, that’s what a democracy is. A lot of us spoke up when war was started against Iraq without Congress authorization and with no clear and present danger. A lot of us are against the Patriot Act that has allowed for surveillance of dissenting citizens, against torture and many of the “because I say so” policies of the Bush Admn.
… And were labeled traitors because we did.
sticks and stones………..the labelers have the right to their opinion as well in a free society.
That’s right, Olga. We’re all entitled to our opinion. Thank you for acknowledging it, but it really isn’t necessary.
Hi,
I refer you to this current post on VN for more info on at least the bailouts. Kitty O’keefe has other finanacial posts that really explain the situation well:
http://www.vibrantnation.com/our-blog-circle/financial-planning-for-todays-woman/mad-as-hell-about-financial-bailouts—here-s-who-did-what-/
First, lost jobs as a consequence of increasing the minimum wage is a myth. Also, not everybody that works minimum wage does so for “pin $”; a lot of them are women and minorities not allowed to break through in better paid positions. W/o regulations, we would go back to employment of children, overtime not paid and dangerous working conditions- all these situations still exist, and flourish immediately when there’s no restraints. We just experienced a huge collapse in the financial sector because of lack of effective oversight regulations.
The salaries and golden parachutes of CEO’s have experienced a tremendous increase in the last 10-20 years- I believe it was a 1:20 ratio of worker-CEO pay and now it’s more like 1-150+!! Even in cases where those CEO’s ran the companies into the ground.
Another myth is that they pay the bulk of the taxes. They have so many loopholes and fake expenses that they really don’t pay their fair share. I’ve seen the tie, yes the necktie of the CEO being deducted as a business expense! their meals! food for their household! Remember the golden toilets of a year ago?
Now, there are a lot of ethical corporations, but we also have too many that buy smaller companies simply to stifle competition, so where there was a thriving source of jobs, then Big One comes, takes over and the place closes down. Do their earnings increase? probably. Is this ethical? Good for the country? No. It used to be that the rich felt somewhat responsible for the well being of their employees. One of my two rich uncles routinely paid for the medical treatment of his ee’s families, provided some with housing and helped them out in emergencies. I think it’s great when people are rich: we don’t need any more poor people. I admire somebody that creates jobs, but jobs where both the company and the workers receive their fair share.
Take the example of the insurance companies. Think about how they have affected the corporations – like the automakers- that have tried to do right by their employees. In this way, greedy corporations not only affect their own employees and communities, but smaller companies that find it hard to compete. And lastly, I rather earn my own money than having it be given in handouts as charity, thank you very much!
Double post. Hate that.
Much much less than 5% of AMerican workers earn minimum wage…..something like 2-3%. In fact the average american worker earns over $22 per hour.
This bit about the rich not paying taxes is urban legend. The vast majority of the so called loopholes and deductions have been closed and are a thing of the past. The top 1 percent of taxpayers paid 33.7 percent of all individual income taxes. This group of taxpayers has paid more than 30 percent of individual income taxes since 1995. Moreover, since 1990 this group’s tax share has grown faster than their income share.
I too am a fan of small business and bemoan the mammoth organizations swallowing up the small.
However insurers are not the demons the liberal left make them out to be.
Health insurers posted a 2.2 percent profit margin last year, placing them 35th on the Fortune 500 list of top industries. Other health sectors did much better – drugs and medical products and services were both in the top 10. The railroads brought in a 12.6 percent profit margin. Leading the list: network and other communications equipment, at 20.4 percent.
HealthSpring, the best performer in the health insurance industry, posted 5.4 percent. That’s a less profitable margin than was achieved by the makers of Tupperware, Clorox bleach and Molson and Coors beers.
UnitedHealth Group, reporting third quarter results last week, saw fortunes improve. It managed a 5 percent profit margin on an 8 percent growth in revenue.
The latest annual profit margins of a selection of products, services and industries: Tupperware Brands, 7.5 percent; Yahoo, 5.9 percent; Hershey, 6.1 percent; Clorox, 8.7 percent; Molson Coors Brewing, 8.1 percent; construction and farm machinery, 5 percent; Yum Brands (think KFC, Pizza Hut, Taco Bell), 8.5 percent.
Now, does all that sound like an industry that’s reaping obscene, immoral and unfair profits and are willing to let the bodies build up to protect them??
I’m not a fan of insurers–I think all healthcare should be not for profit–but as long as it is legal, I think it is unfair to villify them while the very people making us fat, obese and drunk and get a pass on their profits.
Now where did you get this figure?!!! Average wage $22?!!! Yes, if we include the mega salaries or CEO’s: 50 people making a couple billion and a billion making $9.50 should average about that much. Yeah.
As far as the profit margin, if it’s that low than it’s because, again, the huge salaries for CEO’s. What really matters is how much they spend in actual premiums paid and not in “conventions” and goodies for themselves. If it’s such a bad business, how come they’re fighting tooth and nail to keep it?
I misspoke when I said average, I should have said median. However, yes indeed, the MEDIAN wage for American workers in February 2010 is over $22 per hour according to the most recent report by the Bureau of Labor Statistics. Here’s the link: It quotes $22.45 toward the bottom of the page.
http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.nr0.htm
MEDIANs are not impacted by the extreme top or bottom and are a truer reflection than an average.
CEOs make ungodly sums no question: its that supply/demand thing again as well as the fact the good ole boy system does tend to have them on each others boards. And they get fired with a degree of regularity that most of us don’t endure….The average CEO lasts 3 years before they are fired. And the figures often quoted that really exacerbate the dollars are stock options that they may or may not actually be able to convert to cash and whose value changes – up / down — over time.
I’m not saying that they dont make tons of money—oh they do. I’m just saying that it isn;t as if all those millions are real dollars in their pockets each year–usually just $2-3 million is in cash and bonuses (haha) I am saying that the way the reproting works it exaggerates their real income a tad.
Yeah I dont cry for them either. But the real numbers are a very small percentage of their (the insurance companies) overall payroll.
Dallas Lady, I just looked at the figures at the BLS and there are many,many occupations that pay under $9/hr. Also, a lot of people only get to work part time jobs.
Another point, CEO’s if they’re so valuable that they must get such astronomical pay, how come they get fired so often? All the perks they get is not to be dismissed. Also, there’s a tremendous disparity between inflation and rate increase for health ins. Don’t you think if it was such a bad business they’d go into some other kind of business? In Mexico, way before it’d gone to the narcs, you were able to go to the Social Security hospitals for free- well, not for free, there were payroll contributions. But it was excellent care for everybody. I’ve been gone so long that I don’t know how it is now, but up til a few years ago, they took care of my mother until the very end. Socialized medicine and education are not a bad thing! The northern european countries have them and they are reported to be the countries where people are more content. We don’t want govmt. bureucrats telling us what medical care we can or can’t get? The Ins. Cos. bureucrats already do!
Yes,There are many many occupations that pay under $9. However there are many many many MORE — far more — that pay over $9 or the median wouldn’t be $22. It is the math, plain and simple.
You can have your opinions about the data, but you don’t get to have your own data. The fact is the median — the middle — is $22.
THey get fired so often because it is an extraordinarily difficult business to make a profit in — as the operating margins show.
Demonizing insurance companies as the source of this mess is ignoring about 20 other factors involved. They are but one piece of the puzzle. THey also aren’t even necessary, they are generally middle men.
That’s why complete total rehaula and reform of the basic financing structure of healthcare is needed.
Not the data I saw on the Labor Bureau website. Not what I see around in real life.
MagentaRose, the BLS itself SAID that the median was $22.45. Read the entire link.
The median income in the US in January for all workers was $22.45. Period.
DOnt let the facts and data persuade you then. The BLS is only the single most informed source of compensation in the entire country–why should you trust their national database fed by every employers’ every pay period filed tax reports over your feelings and what you see in “real life”….because after all you see the reality of the 299,999,999 other Americans, right?
As I’ve said: You get to have an opinion about the data, but that doesn’t change the data.
The meaning of the word “median” is in the middle of all. That means as many people make MORE than $22.45 as who make LESS than $22.45. It isn’t skewed by extremes on either end. It is the single most representative statistic within a large dataset. At least that was the meaning of mathmatical “median” when I was in the 3rd grade. Not sure if new math has changed the definition or not. But since I graduated from college and passed my math courses there too, I’m sticking with it until someone proves me wrong.
Your mileage clearly varies. Sorry you don’t like the data, but that doesn’t change it. Nor do you get to change it either.
I totally agree that money, itself, is neither good nor bad. It is the materialist attitude that is associated with money that causes the judgements.
The wealthy have spent long hours accumulating wealth. And this very often happens to the detriment of any other relationship in their life. They tend to make money their only purpose in life, thus eliminating any other purpose for living, including loving.
Someone without ambition would not end up wealthy. It is just the nature of the accumulation. And perhaps it is our nature with regard to money that is more important than the wealth itself? We all set priorities.
God bless, J
I think the basic problem is the widening income gaps in our society. The wealthy and the poor are increasing, while the proverbial middle is dwindling. This is very real and will have ongoing repercussion for the U.S. Our political stability has been based on a prosperous middle class and the belief that everyone could aspire to that standard of living. At the same time our celebrity obsessed culture provides an endless parade of extravagance. I agree that many of those who appear to have more have worked very hard to enjoy the standard of living they enjoy. That does not mean, however, that those who have less, have necessarily worked any less hard to keep their heads above water.
I’m so thankful for the wealthy and for the prospect that anyone can be wealthy in this still great country. After all, I don’t know anyone that works for the guy in the slum down the street, or the minimum wager at the convenience store! We owe some part of our earnings to the rich successful person or successful company that employs us. And if we are really blessed and pay attention, maybe we can become a wealthy person that can bless others with employment and security by becoming a business owner. Now if we can just get that across to more people, especially those that are looking for a handout from the government, a government that is all too eager to take from you and me and give to the lazy, we would all have more cash in our pockets!! Whoever said earlier, “keep your hand out of my pocket”, spoke the wisest words of the day.
Canada is certainly a welfare country. And there are many issues around welfare that kick in without us kicking them down. The ‘haves’ can and should give to the ‘have nots’ in some fashion. Perhaps having to earn a hand out would put some oomph into those not making the effort to work.
I do believe in free enterprise and would like to see more entrepenourship in Canada to employ more people.
God bless, J
Hello
I really feel it is time to put more effort into helping those who want to help themselves. The working poor, the ones who want to work. I have been without a job for close to a year, no one wants me, I am 52 and is very hard to get hired. I have been living off my savings, so I have to be very frugal. I had to leave my job due to health reasons, but I worked for a small business that did not offer health benefits, so what does one do? I am in this situation not because I was waiting for handouts, or didn’t want to work, I am here because my body gave up on me. I am sure there are many others out there who live like I do. All I want is to wake up each morning and have a reason to live, go to work and be a productive member of society. We should change the focus away from the few who abuse the system and put focus onto the ones who just want to make a decent living.
Life is too short, lets work on shortening the gap. Next time you meet a “have-not” don’t assume they are lazy and waiting for a handout. Many would dye first. Lets open our hearts and be thankful for what we have. Being over qualified is a phrase I am sick and tired of hearing. i am applying for this job, of course I want tit.
A lot of attention is paid to “abusers of the system” recipients who get away with bilking a much smaller portion than corporations that receive “subsidies” that they don’t need. Where is their call for less government then? I think from what I read, many of us listen to the political commentators opinions and don’t pay too much attention to the news on the middle pages of the paper.
Tundi Kit, good luck and get well soon. I think your comments are very fair and well explained.
Hello
One more thing I would like to add. Recently (meaning the last 10 years) there was a lot of talk about extending weekly hours of work to 60 without overtime. CEO’s and business owners believe they work 60 hour, without realizing they spend most of that time having lunch, dinner, playing golf and so on……! The working poor, puts in their 60 hours, looks after their kids, cooks at home nutritous meals, helps with homework, takes laundry to laundromat and cleans house, and oh yeah sleep but when. And to think that this person is labeled lazy and just waiting for a handout, is absurd.
So thank you, I don’t know what the future will bring, but hope for the best. Even if by these posts we only changed a few peoples views it is a good sign.
May you spread love and peace.
Tundi
The working poor is more and more becoming the true REAL name for the Middle Class. To hold onto a job you have to put in more ‘unpaid’ hours. Business Owners have the option of working less and getting the same money – employees have their every break/lunch monitored. Yeah, CEO’s work more hours – they should because they are being paid a superior salary. The working class, order NOT to be part of the next company RIF, must work more and harder with no extra pay. We’ve all worked with this people, first in and last out who are insuring their continued presence in the workforce….I met another one of them at a job hunting workshop yesterday. After 3 months of unemployment, He was still feeling like a deer in the headlights of a car. Except his ‘headlights’ was a mortgage payment. If working hard and doing a superior job doesn’t assure your continued employment, what does?
I, too, live in Toronto. And as a charitable person I watched when the government cut the welfare by approx. 1/3 and left many families without some much needed necessities.
Yes, I agree there are some real needy people. The system was set up and then abused by the lazy. It is giving the truly needy people a real struggle and hard time to even exist.
The government now claims they have solved these problems and put the dead beats to work. There are no statistics to prove this and it just isn’t true. The new students coming out of school and unable to find work are lliving off their parents instead of the welfare role. There goes that statistic!
In the newspaper around Christmas time one year I think it was the mayor who said that the charities could kick in and feed the homeless and hungry, as well as those on welfare. It actually was a problem. You see the welfare act is written that whatever is given to the recipient of welfare, must be deducted from their next cheque. And the mayor was reminded of this in a public news interview.
Another time around Christmas was the story of a woman with 3 children who was given subsidy to study and get off welfare. What a wonderful program! She became a legal assistant and got a job. At work they gave her a lot of overtime around Christmas and she thought how she could give her children a better Christmas. Instead the welfare kicked in and took any extra she may have had.
These are real and valid problems. The government (and a lot of people) don’t like the welfare roles, but they do nothing to aid the working poor and those who would like to help themselves. I have seen it up close and personal. And they wonder why people try to abuse the system!
I truly wish you every success in your endeavours! It would be nice to be supported, not just financially, but also socially so that you can make a contribution according to your needs and abilities.
God bless, J
Thank you spiritalk and magentarose
You to me seem to understand and didn’t get caught in the belief that all have-nots are lazy and useless. With every program there is a percentage that will use and abuse. I really feel it is time, to stand up for those who don’t feel entitled, but honestly just want a life. Work is a majour part of that. If you don’t pay into it, you don’t deserve it. Lets take the filthy rich and the ones who have never worked out of the equation, meaning concentrate on the working poor. Stepping outside of the box is what will re-ignite our economy.
In short if you are a business owner, can you hire one more person? How will this decision impact your profits along with your heart health. What do you think?