| “Aging gracefully?” – interesting article in NYT | Hot Conversation |
Interesting article in the NYT: “Should women simply grow old naturally, since their looks don’t define them, or should they fight the signs of aging, since beauty and youth are their currency and power?”
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/18/fashion/18SKIN.html?th&emc=th
It’s not a simple question, love to know what others think.
Posted in fashion & beauty, news.
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The toughest part for me, as an adult who has put my difficult childhood behind me, is dealing with family members who are in denial about anything being amiss about how we were raised and the impact this has had on our on-going relationships.
W
Oil of Olay moisturizer. I have had dry skin since I was in my 20's. Now that I am in my 60's.....Oy! I have always used some type of Oil of Olay moisturizer. I am now using the Age Defying creams, and like them alot. Oh, and Chap Stick under
ReginaLove, that is SO great to hear! As for soy, it may help with menopause symptoms -- it it controversial. The best way to use soy is in the form of whole fermented soy foods (miso, tempeh, tamari and natto). Non-fermented soy foods such as soy mi
Agreed. I never thought I was vain until I had a mastectomy at age 39. I was devastated and told the doc I wanted to wake up with implants. Now at age 60, I am lopsided and wondering if I was just avoiding the inevitable. You get what you get and you
Sounds very interesting.
Yes, it is an interesting article. The book appears to give us permission to think like so many of us do about this inevitible aging thing. Even if we simply choose to hang out with people our own age or older, it’s still difficult to erase that which is in our own minds. Wouldn’t it be nice if us elders could be acknowledged as the people of accumulated knowledge and common sense that we really are?
I agree it would be nice to be acknowledged that way – in other societies the elderly are seen as a source of wisdom but somehow Western society has the opposite view. Not really sure why or how this happened.
Maybe I missunderstood the article but I will not run out to buy the book. Why? These are obviously two very lovely women who have good intentions on helping women. But are they really helping? Or are they only emphasizing that which they say they want to diminish in the minds of women. Which is, from my understanding of the article, it is OK not to accept your looks when you age, but it is inevitable, so live with it.
Being a homely looking woman all my life,( except as a young girl, I was cute), I do look in the mirror and see the wrinkles, bulges, creases, drooping underchin etc. But not having grown up thinking I was pretty and needed the makeup etc. to keep me that way, I guess my attitude on the subject is different.
Do these doctors have patients whose looks were never an issue to them or are they all ex-models or people that have cherished their looks all their lives? In my view, the person within is important and should be from the day you are born.
You don’t miss what you have never had. Having been admired for your beauty when you were younger and slowly loosing that attention must be hard to handle for some people.
anir
I understand what you are saying. I never thought of myself as beautiful, so it never was a defining thing for me. Also, my mother and grandmother were also very comfortable with their appearance and the changes to it as they aged. I just don’t get the anxiety some women feel about aging and their appearance. This is what 51 looks like.
Thought I was the only one to think this way. Thanks Brightwood.
anir
I think women of today know a lot more about how to retain youth and health than perhaps our mothers and grandmothers did. Consequently we have more choices. Once there was no choice. You just got old. And, women can be very controlling of one another with comments like ” mutton dressed up as lamb” Who does she think she is? Cougar etc… There is a core of women who almost dictate what a woman of a certain age should look like and can alienate and ostracize those who don’t fit the mould or make more “youthful” choices about how to present themselves to the world. This can and does, affect women’s feelings of acceptance and consequently their levels of self esteem. It seems to me that there is enormous diversity in how people age. Some age so that they still look like the same person but with a few more wrinkles. Others look entirely unlike their younger selves, and still others actually get ‘better’ looking as they age. This has to be about genetics and is something that can’t, at this stage, be controlled.
I really think women would be better respecting each other for the external appearance each chooses to don. Commenting unfavourably about another woman’s appearance, whatever that may be, is what I would consider to be inappropriate and an inability to value the exciting concept of diversity.
Once we get past the physical appearance, we can then begin to relate heart to heart. Then and only then, will we discover a woman’s true uniqueness.
You are absolutely correct that there is a lot of negativity directed at women regarding appearance, not only from the media, but from important women in our lives, Friends, co-workers, mothers. We need to stop buying into it. I recently read an article detailing cosmetic procedures for women at different ages and it suggested receiving collagen and other filler injections starting in your 30′s!!!! I was and am horrified.
I reread what I wrote and did not find that I ‘commented unfavourably about another woman’s appearance’.
The main point I wanted to come across is that there is way too much importance put on looks ie especially looking beautiful and youthfull. We hammer it into a person as soon as they are born by dolling up our children and often telling them, without even thinking, you are so cute, handsome etc. I have done it myself to my own children. We grow up thinking that looks are all so important to the way others feel about us and we should feel about ourselves.
One of my sisters is very beautiful. Most people are often in awe at her looks. It has frustrated her all her life. She is intelligent, friendly, outgoing etc. Even with her good looks, she would get suggestions from people on how to make herself look even ‘better’? A person once suggested she get the small space between her two front teeth filled!
I apologize if I offended anyone. I respect everyone for their uniqueness. I was not trying to put down women who try to look their best.
anir
I didn’t take her comments to mean that she thought you were commenting unfavourably, but was making a comment about society in general. Certainly, I did not feel that you were doing so.
Yes Anir. No hint of a suggestion that your initial statement/ question was judgemental in any way. I thought it was an excellent converstaion starter and totally objective in its nature! This is a subject many women will feel strongly about. Strong feelings often beget strong words!! Thank you for raising it. I will watch the responses with interest!
Sorry Sungal, I meant to direct that one to you. just having what we call a ‘Nanna moment’ in Australia! Thanks for the starter!!
No worries, Dianna, and you’re welcome! I’m enjoying all the strong, thoughtful opinions on this complicated subject. Lots of excellent points being made.
I won’t buy the book either as I see this as advertisement for the women who wrote it. There are too many other books that I would like to read in too little time. I do accept what Cal-Mimi writes in that in working with the public, most rather work with a woman who “keeps up her appearance”, meaning dressing and facial flattery. I have bought into the Juvederm fillers and have had good results as my cheeks are thin. I do suffer bruises and the next time I am searching for a different person to see if it is just my tissues or the practioner. Keeping a few wrinkles doesn’t bother me, but I cannot fanthom a wrinkled face. I have total empathy for the people with the elephantitus deforms, or the poor woman attacked by the Chimp. I would cope somehow, but we know that is a terrible form of existing.
The US is known for their disrespect of their elders. Not everyone, but the majority, from businesses to families, or the families would not dump to the nursing homes. Businesses will hire a young total bimbo that doesn’t know up from down rather than an older woman who could probably run the whole office because of looks and the dollar. It always helps my feelings when I hear them complain about the time it takes to get their product out due to use of computer and texting. Serves them right.
It is awfully hard to have looked good your entire life, reach the 60′s and have kept your physical stature but the facial features start to sag. Therefore, until I die at the office, I will continue to fight the aging process. I do it for ME and for what I see in the mirror. I know I am strong, but this is my trait that I must take the best care of myself, it helps every being in my body. I don’t recall who said this, maybe T.S. Eliot, that if a woman will tell her age, she will tell anything, so this is my way out of telling my age. I let the ages of my children do that.
I love this conversation because I believe we should all ask ourselves why we do what we do in regards to beauty, looks etc. For my blog I do a “shower minute” where I do a video of myself fresh out of the shower (in robe and hair in towel) delivering my inspriational thought of the day. The reason I do it, is because at first it was taking me an hour to get ready for a 2 minute video! I thought: enough! How important is it? How really different do you look with and without make up? And I decided that my innner beauty comes through and that is what I am most concerned about.
I notice in Hollywood, men age quite naturally – with apparently no interruption in their careers or lives. Women, on the other hand, resemble freak-shows by the time they reach their 70s from all the surgeries. It can’t be the Creator’s intention for us to alter ourselves regularly to look like we did. Why would we change? It’s a timely and complex issue for us women that I will continue to examine.
Christina Watson (footprints at fifty)
It starts in the home, yes I said it! The child that is the best looking gets the attention. They’re soo cute, real beauties, handsome, the favorites. The good looking ones get better choices. We mothers teach it from the beginning of life. When my daughter was very young my mother wanted to put her in a beauty contest, my answer , NO! To tell one little girl she is better looking then another little girl, what the hell is wrong with us? We are our own worst enemy. Society is corrupt and we play into it. There is nothing wrong with looking your best but everything can not be put off on looks. My mother is the one who let me know I wasn’t the beauty in the family. Well today, I look younger then my sisters without doing any procedure, who knew! We are all getting older, if GOD should spare your life. Haven’t you seen women with no gray hair older then yourself looking foolish! No wrinkles but body doesn’t match! If you are doing a procedure for anyone but yourself, beware! Halle Berry and Jlo both had husbands that cheated on them, are they not American beauties….TRACK
A few years back my daughter and I were sitting in a very exclusive spa in Palm Springs Calif….and sitting next to me was a stunningly beautiful women getting a pedicure/manicure. Her blonde hair pulled back in a tight pony tail….beautiful expensive outfit, a very beautiful face with not one wrinkle, lifted boobs….everything looked perfect and youthful…..UNTIL, I looked at her hands and feet! OMG…..this woman had to be at least in her 70′s if not older…..bunions, hammertoes, veins, wrinkles, thin skin etc…..tell tell signs of age, but the other part were that of a woman in her 40′s! Oh yes, I even could see the scarring from the face lift, behind the ears!!!
Maybe in my lifetime they will be able to surgical enhance the hands and feet to be youthful too!
My daughter and I still talk about this incident and the visual is a reminder to love thy self with all earned signs of aging.
I’m smiling here! I am of the opinion that with all the money that has been paid to the cosmetic industry by us all frantically buying creams / surgery in a desperate bid to make a difference, they should have been able to come up with a solution to dip us in when we are about 28 which would preserve us on the outside until we die!!! However, that would not be in the interests of a business sooooo lucrative now would it??? There is no doubt that our insecurities associated with the aging process drive us to part with our hard earned dollars at a rapid rate of knots. Me thinks this is the real definition of what Aussies refer to as “sucked in”.
But ofcourse they never will because imagine what would happen to the cosmetic industry then!!!
There is also a “class” component to this: the pushing of a standard of beauty for older women that is unavailable to anyone of a lower income.
earned signs of aging…. I could not agree with that more!! I do my best to keep my skin healthy, dry brittle skin is subject to infection, but I will never have a face lift, my hands so the hard work I’ve put in to be where I am today, and I earned the right to those signs of aging and gaining what I have. Our media I believe is to blame, always putting out there that we must be young looking, that aging means we lose our minds and our intelligence and are of no more use, other than to be warehoused in nursing homes and forgotten as soon as possible because we remind everyone that they are headed in the same direction…. god forbid they should grow old an die… it is the sad and silly search for eternal life, and ladies that ain’t gonna happen.
beautifully said….. (((((((hugs))))))) <3
hugs back my dear, keep your skin healthy and moisturized, all over your body, because dry brittle skin truly is unhealthy, but take pride always in who you are, you’ve worked hard to earn who your are so be not ashamed of a few wrinkles or even a lot of them, they are markers of being wise in the ways of the world.
This is the saddest of all……I truly believe in taking the best care of myself and others, but not to this extent. I bet this woman would not walk a mile, so what’s the point?Seeing someone like this is an eye opener. This is when you feel sorry for the women, as they don’t have a real life other than being pampered. I’d rather have mentally stimulating conversations than sit at the spa all day. I want to look my best but not like this woman.Look at Joan Rivers, she looked much better before all her “lifts”.
Speaking of Joan Rivers AND hands showing age—she has beautiful hands! very smooth youthful looking–enough that I bought the hand cream that she swore was the secret to her hands looking so great. I bought it–once. It was on one of the home shopping channels. ‘Stuff’ always seems like a great idea at 2 AM. Now I just write down the item number so I can think it over the next day. ; )
Never mind—she has her hands ‘done’ too. Lasers, filler what ever.
Another point of view. I must have some free time on my hands!!!
Serious beauties often dont have any friends!!! Its a lonely world out there for those who are beautiful and ‘envied’. Men proposition them all the time and for this, other women feel threatened by them. PIty help the poor woman who is beautiful and finds herself single!!! She is often striving to look good because of a low self esteem and an insecurity about being alone. She tends to act in a more demure, alluring manner and what man isn’t attracted to that?? Then other women reject her and don’t include her in social gatherings , because she threatens their relationships by arousing the interests of their men, so, failing to understand this, she goes home and tries even harder, which, in turn, alienates her even more …and so the vicious cycle continues. Perhaps beauty really is a curse. In the words of Dorothy Parker, “What fresh hell is this?…..
I have a sister who is eternally attractive to men. A trait that has never ceased to perplex and embarrass her because she has never seen herself as a great beauty as such. She has an allure that is hard to pinpoint but its something to do with a combination of intelligence, gentility, respect, humility, voluptuousness and kindness. Her solution was to sincerely befriend the woman and show the men that the bond between her and their woman was based on strength and loyalty. She still, at 55, has what she refers to as unwelcome advances from males ( she is happily married) but her friendship with her woman friends, reassures them that all is well. They get cross with their men that way for being weak!!! I might add here that her allure is enviable!!!!
allure is an attitude, not an exterior appearance. Self esteem and compassion and undeniable love for one’s fellows is what is alluring. How many women have we all known that are so wrapped up in how they look that they have no time for the true values of friendship and caring? I’ve known many and I always felt sorry for them. Being aware of one’s value shines through and that is what is alluring.
Ess. Solo, said “allure is an attitude, not an exterior appearance. Self esteem and compassion and undeniable love for one’s fellows is what is alluring”. I couldn’t agree more. Since my late 20s I go out alone, dine alone and will travel alone. Do I like company, yes but can not live my life, hoping nothing unexpected comes up for someone else. I meet people everywhere and have a great time. Males like me because I’m fun. My age scares most back from me, but the ones that are up for the adventure, seem happy! I’m not looking for marriage, just good company and new things to do!
P.S. David Bowies’ wife IMAN,looks wonderful, her secret as well as mine, never leave your face dry, never! moisturize, moisturize, moisturize!
) TRACK…Liking myself at 60
Ms. Friedan said it better than I ever could, “If you’re going to pretend it’s youth, you’re going to miss it.”
I think we should grow old gracefully. Men go grey, get wrinkles, get fat and out of shape and just go out and buy a hot car. I think we should do the same.