Vibrant Nation

fashion & beauty

A former model on anti-aging
posted 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I think we are a generation struggling to find pride. We don’t wear it on our faces enough.

I just spoke to a plastic surgeon who, with pride, told me that his clientele is getting younger and younger because he’s now convinced he can keep them from ever having wrinkles. Okay. So what is that? An authority?

Now I think there are great plastic surgeons out there. I think there are great dermatologists who are really looking to prolong the health of women’s skin. That is a great approach. We have to do that. We have to stay out of the sun. There are lots of products we can use. There are cosmetics that make women’s skin actually look better.

But you have a group of authorities both in the media and in the medical world promoting the anti-aging movement. Think about that – anti-aging is anti-being 50. Anti-being 60. I don’t think that’s a great expression. And yet we take it for granted because we see it all the time.

7 members love this!

responses (182)

Tamara said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I think it's so sad, really I do. It seems like it's becoming almost criminal to sport some lines on your face, or let your hair go gray.

Several months ago, I actually got into a huge verbal debate with another middle-aged woman over....JESSICA TANDY! I casually mentioned that I thought the late actress was such a beautiful elderly woman, with no problems wearing her age proudly, nary a nip or tuck on that face.

The other lady replied she thought it was nothing but sheer laziness that an older woman wouldn't take the steps to do whatever it took to keep from looking old.

I won't bore you with the entire conversation, but I think we both agreed to disagree.

Honestly, I was 30 when I stopped caring what people thought of my outward appearance. Most days, I'm totally natural, no makeup, jeans, etc. But for special occasions, I will doll up a bit!

As far as plastic surgery, botox, etc....nah, not for me. I'd rather spend the money on travel!

13 members love this!
Dr. Vivian Diller said to Tamara 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I love everyone's responses! I believe as a generation of baby boomers hitting midlife, we have strength in numbers and can change our culture's perception of aging women. We owe it to our selves and the next generation to care about our appearance in a healthy way so that getting older is viewed as a phase of life we can enjoy! To me, beauty is about prolonging the health of our skin, keeping our bodies in shape, remaining productive and vital. And enjoying our femininity until the end of our lives. How each individual woman decides to dress or make her face up is really a very personal choice. But more women need to join together with our strong voices to can change the way other women, authorities, dematologists and the media portray beauty as we age.

4 members love this!
Marji Messer said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I have discovered that a) alot of beauty is related to how well you took care of yourself when young, and b) genetics...that being said, my late mother passed away in December with nary a sag or wrinkle at 92 years YOUNG because of her love of life, sense of humour and spirit....the only true beauty is spiritual beauty in my book, ( and ps I have had some work done and now regrets about that!!!)  but live your life with joy, passion and courage and your true beauty will come through...

3 members love this!
Reenie said to Marji Messer 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

My mother was 8 days shy of her 87th birthday and the nurses thought she was 67...never had any work done on herself.  She was a natural beauty inside and out.  I know she is dancing in heaven now.  She always wore make up and taught me never to go out without it!  Her inner beauty came through.

1 member loves this!
Tosia McCormick said to Reenie 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

If a woman teaches her daughter never to go out without make up, she is telling her that her own looks and natural beauty are not good enough...and never will be.

3 members love this!
Debbie Pre said to Tosia McCormick 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I'm sure she taught her to enhance her natural beauty with makeup, not cover up with gob's of paint.  She taught her to put her best face forward and not to be lazy!

3 members love this!
junebug43 said to Debbie Pre 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Debbie, that's the 2nd reference to "being lazy" if you don't put on makeup.  I don't see the connection.  If someone doesn't want to wear makeup, I never thought about them being lazy.  I do believe we older women are bombarded with all the botox, makeup, etc. and most of it is just a way for these companies to make money!  

4 members love this!
WiserNow said to junebug43 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I do not invest the time or money in alot of facial products. I have the basics.  I use a good sunscreen, and a coverstick for dark circles daily. Thats it. I'm not a lazy person. I eat healthy, drink only water.  Shower every A.M.  Have always been very aware of how I presented myself to the  public. If you choose to bondo your face to  "look good" so be it. Not every woman chooses to wear it. It doesn't make you  less of a lady. Like Dr. Vivia says its all about being healthy. That is the best kind of looking good. There is so much more to us as women than makeup.  I'm not against it or for it, to each her own.  But I agree with June, its not about being lazy.

1 member loves this!
Tosia McCormick said to Debbie Pre 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

What is she telling her son? We have ingrained standards about women's beauty (and men's) for that matter, and our culture relentlessly reinforces them. Imagine what would happen to our economy if we all suddenly stopped wearing make up, dying our hair, getting waxed, manicured, etc. Plastic surgery is  simply at the high price end of this indoctrination. There is always someone making money off our insecurities, but what is worse is that we are self-critical and unhappy with ourselves all our lives.

3 members love this!
Lizbet said to Tosia McCormick 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Agreed!  It is not any different than it was in high school.  If anything, society's pressure is worse for aging, feminist ladies than it is for young ladies who have to compete with Hollywood's ideal.  Laziness has nothing to do with it but our consumer mind set and money often does. The bottom line is, as you say, Tosia, "we are self-critical and unhappy with ourselves all our lives" and that is because we allow media, doctors and even our "friends" to define us, rather than actually caring for our bodies and cultivating beauty from the inside out, both physical and spiritual.

1 member loves this!
Matriarch said to Tosia McCormick 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

yes It's time to say enough is enough.  I am enough, just as I am.  If you don't like it to bad. 

2 members love this!
Celia said to Marji Messer 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

This is the philosophy I hold about aging.  My nother lived to 103 and died of natural causes.  Along the way she had diabetes and completely over came that with the right diet and a belief the what you put into your body as food is powerful and it is responsible for how well you feel and look.  I wrote a cook book to help people choose wisely where food is concerned and to share this philosophy.

Pam Massey said to Celia 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Unfortunately, my mother was just days shy of her 50th birthday when she past away.  She had been fighting cancer for 7 years.  During that time she became completely holistic in her diet.  This, mind you, was a Southern woman who for her entire life had cooked in a traditionally Southern way.  So this change in how she viewed food was nothing short of extraordinary.  The doctors told us after her first surgery, one of many, that they didn't think she would live past six months or so.  She not only beat that prediction by a number of years, but even with all the horrendous surgeries, etc. that she had to endure, she gave herself 7 years full of quality life, not just mere existence.  We do have a choice in how we choose to live our lives.  I hope I can say at the end of mine that I lived fully and that I departed with courage and grace. We are going to age no matter what exercises we put ourselves through.  But if the focus can be on health and quality of life then our efforts won't have been in vain. These days I tend to revere mental acuity and finding opportunities to engage in lively conversation. I am thankful that I have been allowed to live this long and have hopes of living a couple of decades more if the powers that be see fit. I embrace this stage of life joyfully and I intend to fully explore all its potential.

DianaA said to Marji Messer 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

my grandmother is 95 years old and she live her daughter( my aunt) Ruth"s house. my greatgrgandmother was 98 years old and she passed away in 1994and both of young heahlty them had thier sag and wrinkles. i am 50 years old.  my ladies  asked me about look young.  How!!! i am young of my age is 50.

1 member loves this!
smazonson said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Totally agree with your definition of beauty and the role of skin care.  Caring for skin isn’t about turning back time; it’s about wellness. It’s a response to all the things that can trouble skin—like climate, diet, or stress, not just aging. Just as we care about what we eat and when, how we exercise, we also need to nurture our skin’s health —this promotes balance and confidence.  Using the right products with ingredients from nature help prolong the health of our skin, keeping it firmer and more hydrated with better color and clarity.   I recently found a product with the right components and would share with anyone interested.

2 members love this!
Il.Val said to smazonson 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

sure you've got me interested what is the product?

 

Sallygg said to smazonson 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

What is the product.  I am interested but did not see your reply as to what it is>

auntbkaraoke said to Tamara 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I really liked your response. What is wrong being 50, 60, and etc...  I can't afford plastic surgery nor Botox. What is so wonderful about being young????? I have more on the ball now, than when I was younger. I am 60 and very proud to be and I am just starting to blossom!!

Thank you

6 members love this!
Shoppergal said to auntbkaraoke 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Some can afford plastic surgery or Botox or expensive anti-aging products. It is a choice for all.  Obviously some get carried away with trying to look 25 again which is not the purpose. We all should want to look our best - with or without makeup. Also, right products protect the skin from the environment helping to maintain its yourthful appearance.  I am 61 - most think I am 45 - no plastic surgery. Hmmm, could it be I have always used great skin care and makeup to protect my skin?

SeptemberMay said to auntbkaraoke 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Good point. I wouldn't trade my life now for being young again in a million years. We are stupid when we're young, with little formed sense of who we are. Sure, I'd like to have the physical health I did then, but then I wouldn't be who I am today. We are far too obsessed with youth. We need to turn our ideas about aging upside down!

Jesse

 

1 member loves this!
tealpond said to auntbkaraoke 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I find this is the best time of my life.  I don't wear make-up, never have and am more proud of me than I have ever been. 

Katielli said to auntbkaraoke 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

No one seems to be asking "WHY do we want to continue to look young?" Do women feel that beauty is their currency in life, like men feel they are valued by how much they make?What do we feel we will lose by getting old? Attention? Validation from men? Participation in the affairs of humanity? What is it? I'm seriously asking!

Dr. Vivian Diller said to Katielli 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Katielli,

Actually, it’s not true that no one is looking at the questions you raise. These issues are of great interest to me and others who are researching this area, so I'm glad you are "seriously asking." And, although I usually avoid promoting anything on blog posts, in this case I'm going to refer you to the book I wrote (featured here in the VN book club) called, “Face It: What Women Really Feel As Their Looks Change” which has some good answers to your questions. Take a look at it, especially chapter 6, called “Letting Go and Moving On.”

In short; there are research studies showing that beauty has biological roots and that humans are hard wired to find youthful attractiveness appealing. Sociologists look at our culture for explanations, describing how youth has become equated with beauty in media, which reinforces this equation and narrows the standards of what we see as attractive. Anthropologists examine the association between attractiveness, fertility and survival of the species. For millions of years women’s role was to attract a mate and procreate and though our roles have changed dramatically, (especially post feminism), old habits die hard. From this point of view, you are correct that attractiveness serves as a kind of currency and power. Existentialists offer another perspective, focusing on how the fear of death is avoided by a constant yearning for youth. An aging face makes us confront our mortality and human go to great lenghts to avoid that experience.

This brief summary simplifies a very complex issue, but take a look at a more in depth discussion in my book. I describe what women really feel as their looks changes, giving psychological explanations to the impact these changes have on the core of who we are. I’d be interested if you find that “Face It” has satisfactory answers to your very valid questions.

vibrantspirit said to Tamara 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

AMEN TAMARA!

^_^

SeptemberMay said to Tamara 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Tamara you make your point beautifully. We live in an age-phobic culture. "Dignity" is too often thought of as an attempt to fight nature's course, which really is just a cover up for our shame, discomfort and even contempt of the aging process. Whether or not women choose cosmetic surgery is their prerogative - we all have to get through the night. The real problem is that we can't appreciate and celebrate the fullness of character that the aging process grants us. I have written about this extensively in my blog. It is my personal passion to see attitudes about aging change in North America, and to see authentic older women appreciated for the intelligence, wisdom and eroticism that they embody -- botox or not.

Jesse (SeptemberMay on Twitter)

 

DLH2511 said to Tamara 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I think it is sad that at age 30 you stopped caring about your outward appearance. There is no need to go overboard, but taking pride in looking the best that you can only shows that you have respect for yourself.  If I live to be 100 I hope that I still care about my outward appearance!

Matriarch said to DLH2511 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I think we can go overboard in caring for our outward appearance. Clean, combed and brushed should be fine.  Do we have to put makeup on, have the most up to date styles, and always look like we stepped out of a beauty parlour?  Who is judging what caring or not caring is.  I have seen not caring....my mother and mother in law toward the end refused to bathe, didn't change clothes, forgot to put their teeth in etc.  That to me is not caring. 

1 member loves this!
vtdrpickering said to Tamara 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Tamara,

  I TOTALLY agree with you.  I am an active 62 year old who has decided that the time and money spent coloring my hair could be much better spent traveling or doing wonderful things with my grown children and grandchildren.  Now instead of sitting in a beauty salon I am off camping, hiking and going to museums and letting them show me the world that I brought them into.  It's all about the ride....

4 members love this!
fayetteSIPP said to Tamara 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I have learn to be comfortable in my skin, I have also learn the best beauty treatment for me besides eating healthy and drinking water is THINKING HEALTHY AND FEELING THE LOVE INSIDE OF ME. The attitude is what really works it actually makes me glow and people are more complimentary than ever. I love the wisdom that I began to have at age 45 and up would not trade it for youth and ignorance,

I  have had a number of interviews and TV spots to show my art or talk about my Stories for children that I write...once a camera man/interviewer asked if I wanted make up...I am not against enhancement or make up if it is used in balance ...the one thing i do not want is to not be recognized because I have "MADE UP',  I like Lite make up , most of all I try to keep my skin healthy Because  the older we get the worst powder and makeup look, when we try to use it as a cover-up, it actually make us look older. I also don't like the plastic look of many who are in the spotlight,,,a wrinkle here and there is like life's way of saying I CARE, I LAUGH, I CRY I FEEL...I am human and understand .I have lived and have something to share.  

True beauty is deep and have long roots.

Temporary beauty found in a bottle, a jar ,a box , or in a surgery room is just that  TEMPORARY

1 member loves this!
Celia said to fayetteSIPP 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Women have become victims of commercialization. It is embedded in every TV show we watch or any other media for that matter.  It is our job to sit back, reflect and decide what we are going to believe and act upon, and if it is in keeping with our philosopy of how we want to age. Information helps. For instance you can't build build collagen by putting something on yor face.  That is a biological fact.  Its an inside job aided  by what you choose to eat, your mind set and how happy you are with yourself. 

Scuba P said to Tamara 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I couldn't agree with you more. 

Sometimes I wonder how far women have really come.  Beauty has always been a feminist issue and in the 80's we fought against the constant sexualization of women and their body parts.  Now women willingly undergo surgery without even a second thought as to whether or not it is normal, healthy, wise ...  and what it means about our self-esteem and attitudes toward aging. 

Like you Tamara, I find the whole thing very sad.

1 member loves this!
Matriarch said to Scuba P 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Makes us wonder where our fight went when our daughters, are starting implants, and surgeries so young.  When I look at the videos of their music, the tv shows they young women watch, I see where it went.  It went all in the name of attracting a man, and not feeling complete just in oneself.  I am concerned for the generation coming up. 

Scuba P said to Tamara 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I forgot to say....have you noticed how many young women have breast implants?  It's to the point where I give a sigh of relief upon seeing a small-breasted or what I call, a normal looking young woman. 

It's breaks my heart.

TRACK said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Morning, The powers that be must convince us women there is something wrong with us growing older! Too something is wrong, or too little that must be corrected. Most of our lives have been hearing negative things about women over 40. I will challenge that to the grave. We say things about ourselves in negative tones to re-enforce what the media (all stripes) programmed say about us. How we take care of ourselves, our children are watching and listening. Too many young girls start out with the negative, cause they see mommy believing it! VN we been hearing it all our lives but the buck stops here!! I can't say this too much, we have been programmed, challenge what you think about you and other women over 50 yrs. ONLY THE DEAD DO NOT GROW OLDER!!...TRACK
p.s. I will age gracefully, taking care of myself

6 members love this!
Dr. Vivian Diller said to TRACK 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I'll join you in your challenge! Your are right. Women are by nature more critical of themselves than men. There are studies that prove this. We don't need the media or others telling us that aging is a sign of failure or weakness, when aging is natural. Women just gobble that message up and once again feel they have to 'fix' themselves. They believe they have done something wrong when they see their faces and bodies change. Sad, but true. But, something is happening that signals a change. Did you watch the Today show this week? I believe they picked up on the appearance we made (talking about Face It, the book I wrote) and spent this week talking about "Embracing 50." Perhaps we've started something and we need to continue to spread the message. The hosts of the NBC Show, Hoda Kotbe and Kathy Lee, went on air without make-up, showing the audience that they too have signs of aging when they are not made up, lit and dressed to look younger. They had the courage to say, 'yes we look like all of you.' It was really a refreshing comment to the mass audience, saying, it's time we all age gracefully, on screen and off.

1 member loves this!
TRACK said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Thanks doc, however, the powers that be still manipulate the message. The most beautiful women are always according to them and displayed around the world as Anglo-saxon! Never women from around the world of brown skin beauties. America pushs its' message under the guise of being truthful and we know better.
I do not watch television or cable, I'll read a book instead...TRACK
p.s. My daughter said she would do Botox if she could afford it, she just turned 26 yrs old! Never got that from me! Haven't had anything done to my face or body...go figure

1 member loves this!
Tawnya said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Can you imagine the gazillion dollars that would be lost if aging naturally was considered and accepted as beautiful, healthy and self worthy?!  Like so many worldly subjects, humans and their ideals, it's all about the dollar.....

3 members love this!
Dr. Vivian Diller said to Tawnya 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I have spoken to people in the cosmetic industry to try to persuade them to look at what "Women Really Feel As Their Looks Change" (the subtitle of my book, Face It). They are looking now at how to make a gazillion dollars on products that appeal to the aging women that focuses more on healhty skin, keeping faces and bodies from aging prematurely and products that are more appropriate for the millions of women hitting midlife. You are right, it's a lot about money. But wouldn't it be a move in the right direction if it were less about "anti-aging" and more about health and beauty? We'll see, but I believe the beauty industry is moving toward change over the next decade.

Tawnya said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I don't feel the majority of the  millions of American women will buy into "health and beauty" vs "anti-aging... it's like trying to change our thought process on "diet coke" for "coke lite".  Our TV role models have shown us the way with all the "anti aging" processes from botox to facelifts.... I don't know that we have a role model with the gonads to lead the way to "health and beauty" without the focus on stopping the aging process.  Just look at the Miss America Pageant... since 1921, our country has convinced our young girls they aren't beautiful unless they are perfect in the eyes of a foolish standard.  Health, what's going on inside our bodies, was not an issue in past years and it's still not an issue until one becomes ill because we're brainwashed... we know there is a pill for that; or a surgery for that.  So until one becomes ill from lack of exercise, improper eating habilts, too many drugs, too much alcohol, let's indulge ourselves and pay for it later with a botox treatment every 6 months, cosmetic surgery once a year, lipo here and there and under that!

I would love to rattle on but I'm late for my tanning appointment!

Scuba P said to Tawnya 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Please tell me you're kidding about the tanning app't!

2 members love this!
Flower Bear said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I agree that the term "anti-aging" is both insulting and impossible ... we all age whether we look as if are or not. A smooth face and dyed hair is not going to change the fact that inside we're 65 or 70. What would women like that say to each other: "my outside looks great, but you should see my arteries?" The term "anti-aging" makes it sound like if somehow we voluntarily age, we have committed some huge blunder, or maybe even broken some unspoken law. If people would just stop trying to be who they are not, and learn to love and accept who they are, think what a ripple effect that could have.

5 members love this!
Dr. Vivian Diller said to Flower Bear 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Loved your comment. Yes, lets create that ripple effect, around those near to us and those a bit further. We have to speak up, walk tall, hold our heads up and look strong and beautiful. That will have an impact on all those around us more than any words we can write or say.

persimian said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Most people thought I had lost my mind when - at the tender age of 26 - I made the announcement that I was looking forward to turning 50.  I believed - and still believe - that this is truly the age when women fall into their own.  I just wished the younger generation could see that.  I could never understand the appeal people seem to have with plastic surgery.  Why would you want to look like everyone else or for that matter have the space alien look?  Maybe if people of our generation and age were treated and revered as we should instead of being pushed aside for the waif looking youngster we wouldn't be so quick to want to mess up our faces.  I sometimes wonder if these people who are so quick to put a knife to their looks would be recognized by God when they went to heaven!!!  I mean - HE is the one who dictated - do not mar the skin or looks.  What is wrong with these people?!!!  As for me - I'm TOTALLY with Track.  I want to - and will - age gracefully.  And later for anyone who can't deal with it.

1 member loves this!
Dr. Vivian Diller said to persimian 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

My daughter, age 22, feels as you did when you were 26. She says, she looks forward to being at an age when she feels stronger about herself, clearer about her beliefs and more settled in her life. I think she is less afraid of aging, since she sees her parents (age 56 and 66) living full vital lives and plan to continue to until the end as best as we can. Perhaps more young men and women will feel that way as they age if we provide good role models? We all can be that for our children.

1 member loves this!
CarolMarlene said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I totally agree with what you have said about role modeling. If young women have a strong female role model, or luckily more than one, believe it or not these young women are watching and listening and learning and applying what they see in role models who are not afraid of growing older, are vital and healthy and have a zest for life at any age.

They might look and sound like they aren't caring but it is sinking in.  I know, I have been completely surprised by both my daughters when they tell me that they are strong because they watched me, they are not afraid of life because they have seen me go through it and not back down at obstacles but find a way to conquer and move on. So ladies, become the role model you want your daughter or younger woman friend or relative to emulate.

roseann said to CarolMarlene 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Carol, I absolutely agree with you, but I'm not sure daughters very often emulate mom.  I am 73 now - I had a great career that my daughters admired. I wore the power suits, heels and carried that briefcase for many years.  I was meticulous about my professional appearance but never did any plastic surgery. I have 3 daughters - ages 50, 47 and 40.  The 47 yr. old and the 40 yr. old live in a part of Florida where botox is like getting an allergy shot. The younger one has had a breast augmentation, the older one is probably thinking about some minor cosmetic surgery.  The both "botox."  The reasons they give vary.  One might say - I'm in business, I have to stay fresh and as youthful looking as I can. The other says the classic "everyone does it. I feel older than my friends if I don't work at it.  Both are very attractive moms. I think their environment and careers influence them more than what I did at their age. My 50 year old daughter lives in Idaho and would never consider botox or surgery. She does get facials and uses good products and really, looks amazing for 50.  At 73, I don't want to "mess around" with surgery, but I do have a few regrets about things I might have benefited from several years ago.

 

 

I see the whole anti-aging thing as another way to make women feel insecure about themselves.  As aging women and elders we should be revered for our life's accomplishments, not trying to hide our age and retain the fantasy of staying young.  I don't want to grow old wishing I were younger.  I want to embrace older age with a sense that I have accomplished and arrived at something special.  The "youth" machine is a billion dollar industry.  That should tell us something.  If we didn't mind aging where would the fashion machine be - poorer, that for sure.

3 members love this!

Right on Granny in Long Johns. Grannies can create their own machine in place of the "youth" machine if we all were to join together. You know how many women are becoming grandmothers this decade? Let's not be pushed aside. These blogs are the new "consciousness raising" groups of yesteryear. Strength and change comes in joining together in numbers. I've suggested that women create "Face It Groups" (F.I.G.s). It was an idea based on taking the book I wrote, Face It and starting this conversation. It can be done with or without the book, but the idea remains the same. It's time for this conversation to be had outloud, with each other and with the next generation following. Instead of sitting back and watching others determine how we should look and feel, we can take experience back into our own hands.

3 members love this!

Women can only feel insecure if they allow themselves.  Advertising can't make that happen.  Don't have to fantasize about being younger, just be the best no matter the age 50,60,70 and beyond. Looking alive, fresh, and allow change into our lives.

SunflowerLight said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Anti-aging, what a subject like it's a disease or something   . . .  we can't stop from aging but I say that I am 51 yrs young and have been told that I can pass for a woman in her 30s.  It has come due to my diligence regarding my health.  When I was in my late 30's I was diagnosed with Chronic Fatigue with headaches, sore throats, the fatigue . . . it was bad.  To live with  it I investigated what I could do to help myself.  I backed off from all the bad white stuff ie sugar, flour, corn and put myself on high-powered anti-oxidants r-lipoic acid, vitamin C, E, grape seed extract and more.  This has all worked to keep me healthy inside AND out.  I have no health issues (except a few extra pounds) and take no prescription drugs which I refuse to take anyways.  I use the herb Maca for hormone replacement therapy.  I refuse to have any surgery done, I prefer to do it naturally.  And it's lie that we have to stay out of the sun; we need at least 20 minutes a day for vitamin D and for our bodies to regenerate themselves.   We need morning sun so as to set our biological clocks.  Do the research, you will find it out.  Humans get more colds and cancers in the places that don't get as much sunshine as the places that do.  Sorry to go on and on, but we have been sold such a bill of lies all for the sake of the all mighty dollar. 

3 members love this!
JoanPrice said to SunflowerLight 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

"We can't stop from aging" -- oh, but we can! We can die young! Really, that's the alternative to aging. I don't get the "anti-aging" goal at all. We should be celebrating aging. And we do that here on VN, thank goodness.

1 member loves this!
Positivecc said to SunflowerLight 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Thanks Sunflower for mentioning the herb Maca in your comments. I went online and read about it and just ordered some. How is it that such a wonderful product that can help so many women not be more widely known. Guess not enough money can be made on it so not widely advertised.  If I get half the results for my menopausal symptoms that others are reporting I'll be very happy.

Paloba said to SunflowerLight 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Thank you for your comment on "needing" the sun. I am sick of being told to stay out of the sun. Several cancers are on the rise because we have slathered ourselves in sunscreen and are not getting the Vitamin D we need. I'm not saying to lie there and get baked but we need at least 20 minutes of unprotected exposure to get the D that we need.

Also, to all those who rag against "anti-aging"; how many of you color your hair? That's not different than trying to get rid of wrinkles.

I'm against plastic surgery and Botox but I think it humorous when women preach against anti-aging but color their hair.

 

1 member loves this!
lovezao said to SunflowerLight 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I want to be healthy~ but I don't really even want to "pass for" being in my thirties at this point in my life. I have a 38 year old daughter!

suemchenry said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Although I do use facial creams and wear some makeup (about 5 minutes worth), I thank God that I've been given the privilege of living long enough to have wrinkles.  Not every woman has that privilege, and I believe if you could ask those who have gone before us, they would say that those of us who complain of our wrinkles have no concept of what's really important.  Sport your wrinkles proudly, ladies!!

1 member loves this!
Chouchou said to suemchenry 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

My thoughts exactly!  I do use facial creams in order to not look older than I really am.  But that's it!  I am grateful to be still alive.

tinkonthebrink said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Yes, you can have work done that will make you look much younger than 50 or 60...but that won't help at all when you are 70 or 80, and work takes its toll. Is the point of it to be a hottie at 80? Really? Good grief, if you haven't been able to find something more meaningful in your life by then, maybe you should just wear a mask.

Your face, your skin, your body will tell the story of what you have done and how you have lived. Anytime is a good time to start incorporating (literally) kindness, flexibility, delight, curiosity, playfulness...anytime is a good time to start caring more about real experiences than how to manipulate what appears on the surface, anytime is a good time to commit to eating healthy food that doesn't destroy the planet or your body either, anytime is a good time to decide to just inhabit this body and this experience. It's good to start early but it's never too late.

7 members love this!
clibey said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I so agree with all the responses. Every morning I spend an inordinate amount of time adding the straight lines of eyeliner, making sure the mascara is added just right. I am working up the courage to actually step out of the house alalife.  I take care of my skin and do not have the means nor the courage to go under the knife to eliminate those wrinkles. I can remember something I read a long time ago about things that men find appealing in women. And one comment was how nice it is when a woman walks into a room with her head up and her eyes straight ahead ready to meet with whomever she could. That has always stuck with me. Being confident about yourself surely does more for how you look to yourself. And truly, who else matters?

CarolMarlene said to clibey 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I wonder if it is all a confidence thing. Stepping out without a speck of make-up takes a lot of confidence for someone who has hidden behind it for over fifty years. I started wearing mascara when I was fifteen and was actually the only one in high school who was wearing it that year. In my small town no one even heard of it. I had obtained it from a Max Factor radio commercial, waited six weeks for the package of make-up to come. I started wearing make-up to cover my freckles which I had been teased about at school for many years, by boys of course not girls. I hated them and would do anything to not have them.

I wonder about myself though, because even if I am not going out, know that no one is coming and it is a full blown snow storm outside where no one can even get around, I still get up and put on my make-up. Is it habit? I tell myself I am doing it for myself, that is the way I like to look most of the time, going out or staying in cleaning my house or doing yard work. I don't wear a lot of make-up, eye liner, mascara, a bit of blush that's about it. I wonder at our age can we break the habit, if it is one, can be find the confidence somewhere to go out into the world without it, and do we really want to? Freedom is choice and if we choose to wear a bit of make-up whether we are 50 or 15, isn't that our prerogative? I have one daughter who wears a bit of make-up, one daughter who doesn't wear any, at any time. I respect both their choices and they respect mine.

Matriarch said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Ageism still is alive and well.  My husband who is in his late 50's has been told by other men his age that in the automotive field he is washed up.  They try to make you leave because you cost to much, and are gonna retire in a few years anyways.  How sad is that when we discard our elders of society like so much refuse?  For women it starts in their 30's.  We are made to feel if we had a grey hair, a wrinkle, a saggy arm, that we are ready for the rocking chair sexually because we will be replaced by a younger model if we don't, wear chemicals all over to prevent these things, inject poisons to paralyze our nerves so the wrinkles don't come, or worse yet, cut into our otherwise healthy bodies, all in the name of vanity.  If you need to do all that to feel good about yourself, then perhaps it's time to find out who we really are, inside, and let happen what will happen and see what wonderful changes will come about.  There are three phases to a womans life, child, maiden, crone.  Why are we so terrified of the crone stage?  Clinging despirately to the Maiden stage, we cheat our society of our wisdom, of our acceptance of this phase of our life.  We instill fear into the generation before us who are despirately doing the plastic surgery, botox, etc earlier and earlier.  I have stopped dying my hair, wearing a lot of makeup to cover wrinkles, and have instead been working on my mind, and body to keep it healthy, with good food, water and excersize.  For my mind I have went back to school for my doctorate in Naturopathy.  We have as women more to offer than our looks, it's time we all became the matriarchs we all are ment to be. 

2 members love this!
geralyne said to Matriarch 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Good morning Matriarch,

I loved your comments. Yes, our society is afraid of aging: of being powerless and marginalized, in some cases discarded. Which is understandable. In fact, Where can we encouner these crones who have the confidence to bring their wisdom to the world? I love hearing about and seeing women who are asserting what is feminine: using their strength to assert the value of nurturing, caring, and making a difference in the world. Like the Grannies who give support to the grandmothers raising children in Africa.  But it's rare. I fear that most older women retreat and stay home, struggle to survive (due to economic constraints), let alone making a vital contribution to society.

It's time to take back the Stage and to bring a new definition to Beauty. My goal is to remain beautiful, not only in looks; but in the sense of having confidence, "head raised high", valuing my life experience (not degraded by the negative notion of agism), and attempt to bring Beauty to all that I encounter in my life. Not an easy goal. It takes courage and confidence that I often lack. It's diffcult to assert feminine values when all the world is run by consumer logic - including the notion of Beauty.

 

3 members love this!
Matriarch said to geralyne 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

You can encounter the Crones in our society by looking at those who are in their 70's, 80's and 90's and still driving, helping and doing.  The Crones are also in us, if we just let her out.  Most women here are 50 and above, that is when we start to let the Crone in us blossom.  So I would say look without and within for the Crone. 

everyone said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

as long as the media can "sell" that aging can be delayed and/or eliminated and women don't see it for what it is - sales sales sales - as anyone who has seen the prices of anti-aging remedies can atest to - as long as they can sell us that our nature is flawed and aging is a mistake to correct - then we will feed the anti aging machine.

Don't buy it if says "anti aging" or something like that on the label.   There are plenty of products that don't.

 

2 members love this!
janfoster said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

So many inspiring and thought-provoking posts here! I'm a 63-year-old grandmother. During my growing up years, my mother would say to me (at the most appropriate times), "Pretty is as pretty does." I've come to realize that that mantra is appropriate throughout life.

1 member loves this!
Ms. Elegance said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Ha!  I cover this topic as well in my latest book.  Check out www.enteringtheageofelegance.com and click on Did you know that- and read some interesting stuff about the anti-aging industry and you.  Ladies, they're laughing all the way to the bank!

1 member loves this!
Vonda Skelton said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I totally agree! We sit around, bemoaning the fact that the media and the culture have such an obsession with youth and that unless we're blonde, tall, sexy, and YOUNG, we're somehow unworthy. But yet, when we rush out and have all this plastic surgery in an effort to look younger, we're endorsing the very attitude we curse!

Ladies, let's embrace our wisdom and experience! Let's promote the value of and worth in aging gracefully, not in some frantic struggle to grasp at a media/culture-created frenzy!

I'd rather look like my 59 years than look like a 59yo TRYING to look 39. That doesn't say much for our own image of self worth.

But that doesn't mean we give way to pounds and complacency. Let's work at being the best 50-60-70-80 year old (and older) that we can be...in body, mind, and spirit!

Vonda Skelton, 59 and proud of it!

4 members love this!
geralyne said to Vonda Skelton 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I love what you've written Vonda!  I'm all for asserting our value and self-worth!  You're right it does take some work - or valuing of our selves - to be our best.

MaryR said to Vonda Skelton 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

"But yet, when we rush out and have all this plastic surgery in an effort to look younger, we'er endorsing the very attitude we curse!" reminds me of Gandhi's quote "Be the change."

1 member loves this!
Emalani said to Vonda Skelton 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I love your attitude.  That's where I want to be and being apart of this blog and hearing these comments are really helping me to be happy with the person that I am and not what the person that media says I should be.

I totally agree.  The new thing for brides is to get a boob job before the wedding.  Our generation is so obcessed with with keeping young that we have forgoten to embrace our age and we are sending the wrong message to our daughters.  i totally support reconstructive cosmetic surgery.  what a gift we can give to cancer survivors, or someone who has lost 200 lbs.. a fresh start.  But when we just want to change who we are that's a different story.  I had 2 twin pregnancies and have a roll on my stomach as if I had quadruplets.  My exhusband was always trying to get me to get a tummy tuck.  I was so insulted becaue it was his kids that gave me that roll of skin.  I must say, now that I am single again I would love that new start with that tummy tuck, but what kind of a message would I be sending to my daughter?  I think it is very important that we atand up to all of this rediculousness and start showing we are proud of the wisdom and beauty we have at our age. 

 

1 member loves this!
Karma Kitaj said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I totally agree! I have a wonderful woman (her name is Nikki Davis, of Newton, MA) who has given me facials for many years. Of course, she and I want to help me to have the most healthy, glowing skin possible "for my age." She does it with natural products; she's discovering new products all the time that are nourishing for the skin. We know that sun and dryness (smoking, of course) make our skin look older and more wrinkled and sagging, so I block-out regularly and keep a hat with visor on at all times. I moisterize with natural products and do so with sun block every day of the year - winter too.

Do I sometimes think when I look in the mirror or, especially, when I look at myself on camera when I do my TV show ("Alivelihood: New Careers As We Age") that, of my gosh, I really need to get botox to smooth out those frown marks between my eyebrows. And get plastic surgery to decrease the chicken neck I inherited from my mother. But, you know what? I agree with Vivian that it's anti-aging and that's not what I'm trying to convey in my life and work.

See my blog: www.RetirementAsYouWantIt.com

TV show clips on www.YouTube.com. See Karma Kitaj's channel

Matriarch said to Karma Kitaj 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Well it's also important for our health to have 20 minutes of sun everyday.  It helps give us vitamin D which is needed to help absorb calcium.  Wrinkles and sagging are natural.

sylvie said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I think it's interesting that Loreal, Maybelline, Estee Lauder, etc models for the anti-aging products are somewhere between 18-25 years old.  GIVE ME A BREAK!  These women wouldn't know a wrinkle if it crawled out from under the bed and bit them!

5 members love this!
BonnieC said to sylvie 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

And maybe we should write them and let them know we are offended,  and won't buy their products.  Otherwise, it will continue

1 member loves this!
Matriarch said to BonnieC 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I don't buy their products, and I love your trailer in the pic bonnie C  I am a fellow camper. 

Dr. Vivian Diller said to sylvie 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Having been one of those models on television and in print (when I was much younger!) advertising products aimed for women much older than I was, I know first hand how that industry works. I don't think it will change, since executives in the cosmetic and advertising industry are convinced that women don't want to see aging women. But, little by little, if we all speak up, perhaps these executives will hear what is being said in this conversation on VN. Women at midlife want to feel proud of how they look at this stage of their lives and are insulted by the advertisments they see and hear. Let's continue to speak up and see if we can create change.

2 members love this!
CarolMarlene said to sylvie 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Ha ha, I have noticed that too. Close ups of skin that is fresh and young, trying to make us believe that all we have to do is rub on a little lotion and voila our skin will look like that again NOT.

I've noticed it in hair commercials also where they are talking about washing away the gray and the model probably hasn't even seen a gray hair yet. Come on Loreal, Maybelline and the rest, give us some real models so we can relate at least.

Fascinating discussion you've prompted, Vivian. I cringe when someone tells me she's "74 years young" or when a 68-year-old man tells me he doesn't "feel a day over 30". I'm nearing my 64th birthday and don't want to feel young. I want to feel like a woman coming into her crone years, with all the wisdom accrued in a lifetime of experiences. Healthy? Yes, absolutely. That's the sine qua non for every stage of life. But young? No. That's for the young. Been there, loved it. Now I'm loving this stage.

I've had grey hair for a long time and have always been comfortable with it. Recently two of my good friends took a big gulp and decided to stop giving their hair and scalps regular doses of chemicals. The only time I ever wore makeup was when I was a traveling storyteller and performed a lot under harsh lights. I'm comfortable in my skin and my body and enjoy being mentor to some pretty amazing young women. Now I'm blogging about the courage I see around me.

I've ordered your book and look forward to reading it. Thanks for stirring up good discussion.

Cathryn

3 members love this!

I'm interested in hearing your reaction after reading Face It. Let me know what you think.

Matriarch said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Just finished Face It.  Was off on retreat and took it with me.  I found it to be very interesting and informative.  I think it helped me make sense of the last few years. 

Dr. Vivian Diller said to Matriarch 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I recognize that "Face It" is not a page-turner. Nor is reading it like breezing through a novel to find out what happens next. We all know what happens at the end of this story. I knew it would be a tough sell to any publisher, since it is the how-to books that jump off the shelves like hot cakes. And I also knew that “Face It” might not appeal to women who don't really want to read about what they feel as their looks change, even if they are dissatisfied with how our culture deals with aging. So, I am gratified with the overwhelming positive response I have gotten from “Face It” here and in other countries. It seems that more women than I expected are recognizing their personal responsibility (and opportunity) toward making changes in their attitudes about an aging appearance. I think if more women, like you, took the time to understand their internal experience, we would (as a generation) be better equipped to make good decisions about our changing looks. If more women used the six psychological steps (rather than the how-to-fix- yourself-tips described in most other books and magazines) to find ways to look and feel better about aging, I think we could impact the next generation. It might be a grandiose goal, given our youth and beauty obsessed culture, but if “Face It” helped you make sense of the last few years, then I feel very gratified. Thanks Matriarch, for taking time to read and comment on my book.

Matriarch said to Cathryn Wellner 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Yeah I don't like that "74, 80, 90 years young" thing either.  It's as if the very word "Old" is connected with being marginalized, ugly, and decrepid.  Cathryn I'm glad you mentioned this.

Well, can you come up with some new vocabulary that defines the situation we all find ourselves in ? Sorry but you really cannot ignore an entire community of doctors, scientists and beauty pros who are working like demons to combat the intrinsic and extrinsic signs of aging with so-called anti-aging products and procedures. We can revere our experience and knowledge and all the good stuff that comes with age ( hopefully wisdom is also in that mix somewhere ) and still not want to see visible signs of age on our faces and bodies. Let's see if any VN members can come up with a better word than anti-aging since it's the best-selling word around. Frankly I think you're in denial. What's wrong with loving the great parts about aging and not-liking the bad ?

JoanPrice said to Lois Joy Johnson 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Why are visible signs of aging "bad"? A company contacted me about advertising "anti-aging breakthroughs" on my blog. I turned them down with "Sorry, but my blog is PRO aging." 

3 members love this!
Scuba P said to JoanPrice 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

love it!

tinkonthebrink said to Lois Joy Johnson 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Maybe the better word is just life. Real life.

Shoppergal said to Lois Joy Johnson 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Love it - wisdom & confidence is the key. There are positive parts to aging but who doen't want to "touch up" some of the bad.

What's wrong with loving the great parts about aging and not-liking the bad ?

Nothing.  In my opinion, the best parts of aging are in the mind.   I believe in combating the visible parts of aging myself:  no doctors, or surgeons.  No lotions, etc. either - I just live healthy, think healthy and let the chips (or flesh) fall where where they may.

But I believe in the battle.

1 member loves this!
JoanPrice said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Did you see Joan Rivers on Celebrity Apprentice last night? Truly scary. She's had so much plastic surgery that her face is a caricature of herself. When her mouth moves in that tightly stretched face, it almost looks a ventriloquist is making an inanimate object talk. She's such a bright, active woman -- how could she do this to herself? 

catamarie said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I absolutely agree with you that anti-aging is anti-being 50,60, etc.  I think it is appalling that plastic surgeons are encouraging young people to have plastic surgery on their faces.  This is promoting our anti-aging culture in this country, which devalues people as they get older instead of respecting them for their wisdom.  I think plastic surgery has its place; if someone is truly bothered by an aspect of their body and they have thought long and hard about fixing it.  However, having plastic surgery at a young age just so you will never get wrinkles is not the same thing.  I am proud to be 53 and I "look good for my age."  I think we should try to look the best that we can at any age by taking care of ourselves: exercising, eating right, wearing sunscreen, etc.

Melinda Giordano said to catamarie 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Agreed! 

I used to exercise and diet to look good; now I realize that its benefits are two-fold - diet and exercise prolong health as well.  Health is more important than looks, but I'm glad they help me with both!

I will be 53 in June.  I use make up.  I dye my hair.  This is my choice.  I would just assume that certain lines on my face would DISAPPEAR.  But there you are.  I will have to accept what happens despite the care I take of myself.

NEVER surgery.

MiMa jeri said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I just turned 74, have had some major health challenges along the way, and still look pretty darn good.  The only enhancement was permanant eyeliner.  I had it done about 15 years ago and it still looks great.  My eyes have faded from dark brown to green and the eyeliner is a great enhancer.  I believe the secret is to think young, stay active and laugh, laugh, laugh!  No, I haven't had an easy life.  I have experienced divorces, depression, a child's death, financial challenges, cancer, and all that 'stuff'.  Life goes on and everything is temporary...even grief!!

6 members love this!
roseann said to MiMa jeri 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

You have pretty much been through it all MiMa. My heart goes out to you. I love your laugh attitude and I especially love your last line."Life goes on and everything is temporary.......even grief.  I'm 73 and kind of stopped laughing much, but having read your messge, I'm going to work on making it better.

BonnieC said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Most of the "anti-aging" theme has focused on opur external looks rahter than real health.

I have no problem with exercise, nutrition etc that will forestall the wear and tear of age.  Its this constant nonsense that says we are worthless when we look a little bit seasoned, that really gets me.

 

Unfortunately, external "beauty"  has been the measure of a woman's worth for too long a time.  That and skinniness, another questionabl;e trait.  I read somewhere that women are almost twice as likely to be diagnosed with depression, but only in those countries where being super-thin is the female body image ideal...Food for thought

M Diane Gibson said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Why can't we just grow up and accept Life?  We are a nation of Peter Pans; "I will never grow up." This attitude is worsened, of course, by the youth seeking media.  Who wants a world filled with sad Lindsay Lohans who have no clue who they are and what they are about? With time, hopefully, comes wisdom that is FAR more interesting than a vacuous pretty face.

Shoppergal said to M Diane Gibson 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Is this about "growing up?" Looking your best is far from "vacuous." How old is Lindsay Lohan? Her problems are not related to appearance or aging. We will all grow old but why not try to do it with style! We are grown up - but not worn out so why do we need to look like we are? Isn't it kind of like adding a fresh coat of paint to an old house?

Katielli said to M Diane Gibson 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I agree. Life is about being alive. I want to live from the inside out and focus on making other  people feel beautiful and building them up. Those that have done that for me are the most beautiful people I know. I'm not against any "assistive devices" to look more youthful, such as shapewear, etc. but the beauty portrayed in the media is only an analogy for the inner liveliness that is a key to a full life. I have met many physically beautiful people who were spiritually unnattractive due to their preoccupation with themselves and their own beauty....hahahahaa! How ironic!!! To me, a generous smile is the best facelift you can have and it's free, and natural!!!

M Diane Gibson said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Why can't we just grow up and face Life?  We are a nation of Peter Pans; fueled, of course, by the media. Who wants to be part of a generation of mindless, vacuous Lindsay Lohans?  With time--hopefully--comes wisdom and self-knowledge. Embrace it. Ultimately it is far more attractive.

Dr. Vivian Diller said to M Diane Gibson 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I think “anti-aging” campaigns in the media are actually dangerous for the next generation. It instills fear of aging in women, implying that aging should be defied and denied. Younger and younger women are being convinced to fight the changes that come with age, rather than focus on taking care of themselves in a healthy way. One blogger on VN wondered if we can come up with a better vocabulary for this cultural dilemma. I would say, yes, let’s call it something different. Let’s call for promoting and prolonging the health of our bodies and our faces. Instead of working against time, let’s move with the passage of time, by caring for ourselves in a way that allows us long, healthy, full, lives. Instead of ‘anti-aging,’ I say, “pro-aging with vitality and grace.”

Oyebien said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Wow!  Love reading all the posts this comment started.  I think Jamie Lee Curtis is a wonderful role model for accepting ourselves while doing the best we can to keep ourselves healthy.  I also think Diane Keaton and Meryl Streep and Sigourney Weaver are wonderful.  And I strongly agree with the woman who made the comment about Jessica Tandy being a beautiful older woman.  I'm soon to turn 55 and must admit that I'm not thrilled with the changes I see in the mirror but am not bothered enough by it to try and freeze my face or have surgery done.  I too would much rather spend the money on travel.  I do dye my hair and wear makeup (sometimes) and I love the wisdom I have gained from living.  We are bombarded constantly with messages that tell us we're not good enough, not thin enough, not pretty enough.  If you can't turn a deaf ear to those messages then you need to turn off the TV and not pick up another woman's magazine and just live your life and be who you want to be. 

2 members love this!
Pam Massey said to Oyebien 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

The late katharine Hepburn is also a good example of a woman who "owned" her looks during all stages of aging.  She was still elegant looking and so strong in her nineties. She had a zest and vitality for life and was so passionate about living.  That is a fire that comes from within and it creates a glow of youth no matter what ones age is.  I think the secret to the whole matter of aging gracefully, as they say, is being fully engaged with life.

1 member loves this!

I could not agree more Vivian. Thank you for your blog and for your book.

I am a self appointed leader of the campagign for fearless and fabulous aging. I encourage women to stand by their age proudly.

In the pursuit of eternal youth everyone loses. Women lose the gifts of aging. Society loses the wisdom of the older woman and youth loses the hope of a deeper future.

The anti aging movemnt is a product based sell which feeds on the insecurties in women and tells us that we have less value as we age and so our lives have less value.

Well I do not intend to live the next 40 years (59-99) in what I consider to be a second class stage of life!

I loved my youth and my mid life and I am loving the 50+ years too.

Every stage of life has its own unique energy and to really get the most from each stage we must be present in that time to capture that energy.

If we are looking back to youth wishfully or ahead to the even more advanced years in fear ...we are not present for the gifts of now

I am gray haired and quite wrinkled and as far as I can see neither of those things are affecting the quality of my life in the slightest.

 

1 member loves this!
Verona Rojas said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I'm 60 and finally realizing how much life I didn't live when I was younger.  I was a family caretaker for years and was cloistered at home for most of that time.  Looking back I can see that I gave too much of myself back then and now, as a result of that, feel a deep loss of myself.  I wonder how many women not only feel a loss of youthful appearance but also feel the loss of time.  We know we will not be able to retrieve that lost time when our skin was smooth and our eyes were bright.  My only answer is to remind myself as often as necessary that when I was 40 I was very critical of my appearance.  Now, I appreciate how I looked.  When I'm 80, I'll look back at being 60 and will appreciate how I looked at 60.  I'm trying to find a way to appreciate my appearance as it is now before it's part of my past.

5 members love this!
SeptemberMay said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Vivian fantastic post. Absolutely -- anti-aging is being anti-50, or whatever. I did a series for radio on cosmetic surgery below the belt, also known as Designer Vaginas, where women of all ages are conforming to ridiculously-narrow aesthetic sexual ideals, and going in for drastic "surgeries" such as labia amputation and clitoral unhooding (exactly what it sounds like). There is something seriously wrong with that picture. The New View Campaign based in New York has done a great deal to try to educate women on the topic. A thought-provoking blog post on the subject possibly worth checking out is http://flashfree.wordpress.com/  

 

Emalani said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I am 53 years old and just started menopause.  I'm having a difficult time watching myself age. I'm always telling myself that it is a natural process, but still find it hard to accept.  I am planning on getting your book. It's sounds like it has information that could help me cope better with the aging process. 

Dr. Vivian Diller said to Emalani 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

It's women like you -- at the early stages of midlife when physical and emotional changes are first noticed --who I hope will pick up Face It and find it helpful. If women can catch themselves early on, before they experience years of self doubt and confusion, and instead use this book (or these kinds of conversations) to gain clarity and feel better, I would be very gratified. Like the comments we read here on VN, you will read stories in the book that women told me about their experiences at mid life and how Face It helped them understand themselves. When you recognize that you are not alone, that, in itself, is very comforting. There is a generation of women -- millions of us baby boomers – currently facing these changes with little support to help us deal with them. Too much focus is placed on stopping our natural process, rather than moving forward with confidence and optimism. I am very interested in hearing from you and other women what is most useful about the six steps described in Face It. Some women tell me it provides them an emotional guide to get through this difficult transition. Some say it confirms what they already knew, but were afraid to talk about, and has helped them have conversations with other women on this important topic. There are too many women feeling vicitmized by the aging process and it's time for this to change. As yet, on this website exchange, it's clear that there are many women who want to be heard and seen!  In the end, I hope more of us can join together and feel pride in all that we have experienced and allow these experiences to be visibly expressed on our interesting faces and strong bodies.

Paloba said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Thank you Sunflower for your comment on "needing" the sun. I am sick of being told to stay out of the sun. Several cancers are on the rise because we have slathered ourselves in sunscreen and are not getting the Vitamin D we need. I'm not saying to lie there and get baked but we need at least 20 minutes of unprotected exposure to get the D that we need.

Also, to all those who rag against "anti-aging"; how many of you color your hair? That's not different than trying to get rid of wrinkles.

I'm against plastic surgery and Botox but I think it humorous when women preach against anti-aging but color their hair.

Dr. Vivian Diller said to Paloba 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Doesn't it seem that "preaching" for or against how to age is precisely the problem. Telling others what is right or wrong about it all just doesn't make sense. What makes sense is being aware and open and honest about what we feel. I suppose that can sound like preaching, but so be it. It is meant to be supportive of the challenges we all face as we age. We are all trying to come to terms with the fact that aging presents us with change and change is complicated at anytime in our lives. The issue for me is recognizing that we have choices we can make without feeling there is one way to cope as we deal with change. 

Pam Massey said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I have a cousin who is a gifted portrait artist and he says that he finds it much more challenging to sketch a youthful face, because it is so smooth and lacks the character that a mature face possesses.  As an artist he finds it a lot more interesting to draw a face that is mature and reflects the wisdom and character that only years of life experience can provide. The years add interest to our looks and reveal our individuality.  I'm not saying that the changes are altogether welcome, but there is a certain satisfaction that goes along with the laugh lines and even the furrows on our foreheads. Those lines, if you truly think about them, represent the joy and laughter we have shared with friends and loved ones, the furrows on the brow represent the times we have worried over a sick child or felt the pain of loss for someone dear to us. All of these lines have been earned and they come with a good deal of wisdom behind them. Oscar Wilde said “To live is the rarest thing in the world. Most people exist, that’s all.”   I would very much like to be counted in that rarest of categories; one who has lived and continues to live and not just merely exist. And I'm sure I'm not alone in this.             

lovezao said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I just came across an article two days ago while I was cruising around on the internet~

http://inyourface.freedomblogging.com/2010/03/09/plastic-surgery-divides-oscars/15853/

It really confirmed my opinion that plastic surgery helps for a few years, but eventually, people who have had plastic surgery (men AND women~ I was so sad to see Steve Martin in "It's Complicated") end up looking terrible when those few years are over. I understand the pressure we are under to look "young." I even hear it from my 20 year old daughter. She is so much happier when I wear makeup!

Print publications are so airbrushed, etc. Fortunately I do recognize that, instead of beating myself up about my 57 year old body. Also, my husband seems to be very satisfied with being married to a woman his own age! I realiz that that is not the case for everyone. 

I stopped coloring my hair a few years ago. it was amazing how many women told me I should color it, while I was growing it out. My husband was like, "Go Naturalle" and now that it is grown out, women don't weigh in about it like they did at the time. I do like my grey hair.

My number one issue is weight gain. it just takes more and more time to maintain my weight. At some point it becomes vanity, and I need to be able to settle for a reasonable weight, without denying myself all the food I love or spending inordinate amounts of time at the gym.

Life is quite a journey! I'm so thankful to have it to experience!

2 members love this!
Emalani said to lovezao 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I also have been talking about letting my hair go grey and have gotten a lot of grief about it and although I have not gone there yet I do plan on it.  I agree with you about  the weight issue.  I recently started the menopause stage of my life and the weight my weight keeps going up.  I feel the same about settling for a reasonable weight and enjoying this phase of my life instead of fighting it.

Dr. Vivian Diller said to Emalani 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

It’s interesting that several comments above have talked about how other people give women grief when they decide to let their hair go gray.

Since I am continuing to write articles about the psychology behind this whole issue, I wonder if more women can write about how they really feel about this issue. What are your reactions when others tell you, “I don’t like your hair when it’s gray?” Or  when they hear “your gray hair makes you look years older,” when in fact that is the color of their hair, at their age. Does that mean that others don’t want to accept that we all get older? Do they feel fear when they witness their mothers or wives, mates, sisters, or friends aging before their eyes? Does seeing people close to us, remind us of our own aging process? Or, have we grown to feel a general distaste for signs of aging so that we have an instinctive negative reaction to graying hair?

Is it our burden to change how we look to relieve other people’s emotional discomfort? I work to promote the importance of caring for ourselves at any age in a way that makes us feel and look good and if coloring your hair offers that result, then I have no problem with it. But, when going through those efforts  (and clearly these effort can lead to a slippery slope) is primarily for others, then I think we have to be very careful about our actions. In the end, these actions often don’t make us feel better. I want to know what others feel about dying their hair? And what makes us feel so differently about getting botox versus dying hair if either is done because they make you feel and look good? More to talk about.

1 member loves this!

Some hard cold facts from a top beauty editor may jolt you to reality :

1.Very few women have naturally fabulous great gray hair like supermodel Carmen or actress Judy Dench.There is not just one shade of grey- you can have gorgeous icy silvery gray or tarnished looking steel-wool gray, luminous white hair or dingy-looking gray that's more old stainless steel than platinum. And surprise ! Lots of gray-haired women you think are "natural" actually go to a salon and have the color brightened or enhanced with cool toned streaks to give the color that appealing look.

2. Gray hair is coarse and lacks shine. You need every bit as much maintenance to keep the texture shiny, glossy and healthy-looking as you do when you color your hair. This means moisturizing shampoos and conditioners, hair masks to deeply hydrate, and blow-drys because smooth hair reflects more light.

3. Gray hair that is just grown long looks neglected - as if you don't care anymore. It can be long but cut long to add style and polish. Or you can decide to go for a shoulder-length bob or layers, but don't think you're off the style hook.

In other words if you decide to go gray fine, but do it with style and with the knowledge that your self-confidence about your looks comes not from the gray or not to gray but how well you gray.

1 member loves this!
Denise Bostrom said to Lois Joy Johnson 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I suspect our ancestors have had discussions on the aging process for hundreds and hundreds of years - even when our life expectancy was just age 25 or so.  It may be how we're wired: to "be attractive" and increase our chances for finding a "good mate."  The difference being today we live longer and healthier lives (those of us lucky enough to have these options) and we have so many opportunities for sustaining good health and, therefore, our good looks.  As far as maintaining my gray hair, I'm happy to have whatever thinning gray hair I have.

 

Shoppergal said to Lois Joy Johnson 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

All so true! Gray hair "au natural" is dull, lifeless. Can keep it gray but add shine,pizazz.  Love it.

Dr. Vivian Diller said to Shoppergal 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Your comment above strikes the right balance that I think we are all talking about. Caring how we look doesn't have to mean turning back the clock. We can care for our looks in a healthy and stylish way. We don't betray our feminist forebearers by saying, "Yes we care how we look, but we care more about being true to ourselves. Both matter." Gray hair with shine and pizazz, skin that has lines, that is healthy and glowing,bBodies that change, but remain strong and vital. This is the goal for women who want to live long lives, looking AND feeling great.

Matriarch said to Lois Joy Johnson 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

To say a statement that gray hair is course and lacks shine, is a generalization.  I don't blow dry my hair.  It makes it frizzy, I don't apply products to my hair, it makes it weighed down.  I do however eat a great diet, drink a lot of water, and use shampoo that has conditioner in it,and put conditioner on it in addition.  Another statement like it's fact....you said was Gray hair that is just grown long looks neglected, as if you don't care anymore.  Says who?  I really hate how women make statements like they are fact, and we like a bunch of lemmings are supposed to follow the leader fussing with our hair adnauseum to even be accepted otherwise you are labeled as lazy, or letting yourself go.  I am letting myself be myself for the first time in my life, I am not trying to live up to some experts version of who I should be and who I should look like.  Top beauty editors, don't live in reality, they live in a world where only the outside matters, and they tell you to put all these chemicals on your beautiful skin because it looks OMG old.....they are agists at their finest.  I look for the day, when we all can look at each other, and not "judge" our sisters but see the goddess in  each and every one.

1 member loves this!
JoanPrice said to Matriarch 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I'm with you, Matriarch. I stopped coloring my hair about a year and a half ago, and I wish I'd done that a decade earlier.

Lois Joy Johnson said to Matriarch 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

OK Whatever works for you ! But just  FYI Matriarch The job of a beauty editor is to inform women,  translate news and trends into useful info and help with the decision-making process of looking good while staying healthy and confidant. Beauty editors are experts at sifting through the thousands of products to find the ones that might resonate with you- if you'd let go of old-thinking values and give them a chance.

I believe an additional (and responsible) job for beauty editors is to respond to the genuine feelings and thoughts that contemporary women at midlife are experiencing. I agree with Lois Joy, that as a beauty editor, informing women of style and trends can be helpful. There are millions of baby boomers hitting midlife as we speak who want to continue to look stylish and attractive. But too many fashion magazines promote a narrow definition of beauty. They focus on youthful looks. They rarely exhibit beautiful women who show the kind of variety and change that comes with age. Anti-aging is still the major theme in fashion, rather than aging with elegance, charisma and confidence. True, some magazines are attempting to shift their approach by appealing to the baby boomer women. More Magazine is a great example. But even on their pages, models –made up, lit well -- tend to appear much younger than their intended audience. In print and on television, women in their 20’s and 30’s are used to market products for the older woman. These advertisements tend to undermine the confidence that women need to continue to feel attractive as they age. How many midlife women relate to the women they see in any of these TV ads or fashion magazines? They provoke feelings of inadequacy in many women, and for some, even hopelessness. Perhaps editors and beauty experts (often themselves in their 30s and 40s) assume women at midlife are willing to disappear or become invisible, so why bother? Perhaps they believe there is no money in promoting natural beauty? They should be reading blogs like these to be reminded how strongly women feel about remaining vital –and beautiful—at any age. I hope my book, “Face It”, will help beauty editors catch on to a new trend and if we join together to speak up about what we really feel and think as our looks change, I believe they just might. 

Matriarch said to Lois Joy Johnson 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

There you go again, using the word "old" in a negative context.  I have decided that if I cannot eat the products I don't want them on my face.  I make my own skin care products, and drink a lot of water.  I know they are simple old values, but they save me money, and I spend that on what I want to do which is expand my mind.

Emalani said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

When I tell people that I'm thinking about letting my hair go gray they tell me I'm to young to do that but your right that is the natural color of my hair right now.  I never thought of it in that way.  When I see women who have gray hair I admire them, I like the look.  I'm also tired of roots showing and have to color my hair, to much maintenance.  As I'm getting older I feel like I want to be more natural. 

1 member loves this!
sagein2010 said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I would love to stop coloring my hair but I'm unemployed and I'm competing with women 10-20 years younger than me for a job. I wish it weren't so, but I'm sure that if a prospective employer saw me walk in the door with a head of gray hair it would work against me. Experience being equal, the person without gray hair would be the one chosen. I wonder if it's different in other countries.

sylvania said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I've been coloring my hair since I was a teenager. Not because I had to, but because I wanted to. At 55 my roots come in partly white, partly salt and pepper. Uneven coloring and not very attractive. I imagine if I did let my gray grow out, I wouldn't be happy with the finished product. I'd have to bleach/highlight/color to get the result I'd like. Not really much different than what I do now to make it more like the natural color of my youth, only better. And, because I highlight and lowlight according to the seasons, my haircolor is sort of like an accessory and I like that. I plan to continue with what I'm doing as long as I can afford to because it makes me feel and look good. Perhaps in 5 years the gray will look more uniform. Or, I'll just think coloring it is a waste of time and money. As far as coloring my hair for others, I never considered that a factor. Even when I went blonde and my young son cried because I didn't look like his mommy. Then a few months later, I decided to go back to my natural color and he cried again because he had gotten used to me being a blonde. During his teenage years he dyed his hair often. I think his blue phase may have been his way of getting back at me. ;) As for Botox, never had it.  Don't imagine I will. I was spending quite a bit on facial creams that promise to lift and tighten, but am now just trying some cheaper OTC products. Which may be my way of weaning myself into acceptance of the inevitable.

Debi Drecksler said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

There is a big difference between coloring your hair and getting Botox. I lived through Bell's Palsy  which froze my face as if I had a stroke. I would never intentionally inject a poison in my face that could potentially have dangerous side effects. For what? To look 58 instead of 59?  We have become a society obsessed with looking "perfect" which is why I started my Authentic Me Campaign. My goal is to redefine the word Beauty. Please watch television commercials and read magazine ads that are targeting our age group and understand that the goal is to make us feel inadequate and encourage us to buy their products and services so that WE can be beautiful, too! I don't curse but I will say that this is CRAP!! I feel that our generation...  smart, savvy women need to say  ENOUGH ALREADY!! Our daughters and granddaughters deserve better!!

1 member loves this!
Dr. Vivian Diller said to Debi Drecksler 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

These responses lead me to believe that gray works for different women at different times of their lives. My sense is that if our generation increasingly experimented with finding ways to wear gray hair with elegance and style, we might have an impact on the next generation.  We can create style, by confidently showing how to wear gray well. Imagine, if large groups of women in the media joined every day women and decided to make gray the “new look!” Just like torn jeans, tongue rings or visible bra straps were once seen as unkempt and unattractive, these styles have become a fashion statement, worn by young -- and not so young. Well, why not gray? I’ve had the idea of suggesting to women executives at advertising agencies that they try having their young models dye their hair gray, illustrate them in fashion magazine to see if it catches on. We know how much the media influences how we see what is beautiful, so you never know the impact that would have. Grey could be the next new thing in fashion. Wouldn’t that be “nice and easy” for us baby boomers?

CarolMarlene said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I believe that going gray or not going gray is a total individual choice. I have had others tell me that if I went gray I would look older, and I do believe that. I also believe that when a younger person sees a woman with gray hair, maybe from the back or whatever, she is more apt to be helpful if the woman is doing something she knows nothing about, the younger woman will step in and offer assistance. They will also call you ma'am.

I was also called "miss" just the other day instead of the usual ma'am. I was dressed smartly and did not have gray hair. It is a first impression and like suggested above, if you are in the job market, then you have to compete. I agree that if a lot of authoritative older women in the job force would go gray, then it would open up more doors for the ones trying to find work in an overcrowded, younger women market.

So do as you please, meaning what pleases you. If you want to go gray and feel that it is the right time and the right move for you, do it for you. Let the chips fall where they may. Your family and friends will get used to it, and if some don't, who cares? Having young women dye their hair gray will not encourage older woman to do so. Just look at their younger faces and chic styles, that is all part of the package that will make their gray hair look totally different on them than it will an older woman. There is too much being made of going gray or not going gray. Women, make up your own mind. As for me, I am not ready. I may be someday, but on the inside, I don't feel "gray" yet.

Debbie Pre said to CarolMarlene 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Some people look horrible with blonde hair and some look horrible with red or black but they do it anyway.  Why aren't people happy with the color that really look's best on them?  As you age your skin tone changes, as will your hair.  Go with what compliment's your coloring.  I don't personally mind my few gray's, I feel I've earned them and I am proud of them.  I would color them if they didn't look right with my skin tone.  I have changed the color of my highlight's to match more with the color's coming in at the temple's.   It's still about maintenance.  More grooming and less complaining !!!

Matriarch said to Debbie Pre 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Would be interesting to see how much time we spend on grooming.  Grooming to me is being clean in body and clothes, my hair is combed, usually I have manicured hands and feet.  That's about it.  It takes me all of 15 minutes to get ready for work.  I think we all have different ideas as to what a well groomed person is.  I love the variety. 

1 member loves this!
sagein2010 said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

What a wonderful idea! With the resurgence of Betty White, maybe this is an opportune time to try these things.

everyone said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I have never dyed my hair so just have gray hair that came on gradually and so it never made me look "older" - I just looked the way I looked.   Now people who haven't seen me in a long time might be surprised by the grayer but not so much as when a woman who has dyed her hair her entire life suddenly becomes ill or unable to dye it anymore - then it will seem to her friends and family to age 20 years in a few months like my mother and grandmother.  I figure why shock people later just go gray natural.  I do wish there were more products for gray hair - now that my hair is mostly gray I have had to change products to blonde products because the dark stuff discolored my hair.

TRACK said to everyone 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Morning, Shimmering Lights, Clariol keeps gray from brassyness, and stay silver or white. Do not leave on more then 5 minutes, will turn purple!...TRACK

 Think about that.There are so few women 50 + in the public eye-so few CEOS,news anchors, politicians, writers, and celebrities with gray hair and I have to reiterate, there are some very good reasons. Gray is not percieved as sexy ( still important ) or youthful ( meaning healthy, energetic, contemporary in attitude) and unless you can pull it off with style and a chic sensibility- forget it ! Gray can certainly work against you in the job market  unless you're already powerful and monied and working for yourself. The wrong gray can make you look tired, drab and lacking in polish and maintenance. Like weight gain, gray is an easy excuse women often give themselves to stop caring about their looks. Right now there is a small dye-it-gray movement among 20-something models who use gray as an ironic fashion statement- they also have firm flawless bodies and faces. Why not give yourself every advantage to look better than you ever have before instead of slacking off ?

Paloba said to Lois Joy Johnson 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Why on earth would you say that not dying your hair is "slacking off"? Just because one doesn't dye her hair doesn't mean she doesn't care or doesn't do anything. I still wash and style my hair every day. I get a cut every 4 - 6 weeks. I use products...

Also your comments above are a bit of a generalization.

1. There are many natural hair colors out there that are dull and mousy, whether they be blonde, brunette or redhead but they are natural. Should every mousy blonde use highlights just because her hair isn't "great", as you put it?

2. Gray hair is NOT always coarse and dull. My hair was coarser when I was young; now it is quite fine. With proper diet and proper products, all hair can look great.

3. ANY hair just grown long looks unkept and uncared for.

 

Dr. Vivian Diller said to Paloba 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

As someone else wrote on VN, "Going gray isn't synonomous with letting go." I liked that comment. Letting nature take its course as we transition to the next phase of life is not synonomous with neglecting ourselves. It actually can lead to the opposite. If we become less preoccupied with holding on to youth, we sometimes learn to care for ourselves in more meaningful and nurturant ways. Big difference between encouraging natural change and "slacking off or "letting go."

1 member loves this!
Lois Joy Johnson said to Paloba 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

 I do believe in the power of hair color. The right color can provide a positive boost to mature facial skin. When you're dealing with issues like hyperpigmentation, textural changes, wrinkles, fine lines and loss of definition hair color can be your #1 cosmetic advantage. I think gray is a choice one must make very carefully.Of course anyone's hair color choice depends to a degree on personal style...or lack of it. You sound like you're on top of things and happy with your looks so gray must be working for you.

lovezao said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

It interests me that this post has become about gray hair. When I originally commented, we seemed to be discussing aging in general, and I included a link about actresses at the Oscars who've had plastic surgery.

I just threw in the comment about gray hair because it was something I had dealt with. I commented that my 20 year old daughter is so much happier when I wear makeup. I will add that she loves my gray hair! She is a student at Purdue and says when she moved home for the summer, she noticed "lots" of the moms who were helping their kids had gray hair.

I think it may be a boomer trend, I don't know. I just know I had a lot of fun coloring my hair when I was young, but when it became "work" to keep the roots done, the fun went away, so I quit doing it! I was pretty surprised at how gray I was~ I had watched my husband go gray for years, don't know what I thought was happening on my head! I can say, HE has never spent a moment of his life wondering whether he should cover his gray!

By the way, this post led me to order the book Face It, and it looks like it will be very helpful!

 

Dr. Vivian Diller said to lovezao 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Lovesao, I'm really interested in hearing if you find the book “Face It: What Women Really Feel as Their Looks Change” helpful. When you read it, you will see that I wrote that reactions to gray hair (and other physical signs of change) are often reflections of more complicated emotions we have about our aging experience. It's a good starting point for discussion and leads to deeper psychological/political/cultural issues women are dealing with today. The comments on this blog confirm for me what I found in researching the book; that getting older in today's youth and beauty obsessed culture is a challenge for most women and that many of us want better solutions than those typically offered, whether is be plastic surgery, botox or just letting looks go by the wayside. The comments here may have digressed back and forth between the physical and the emotional, but both are important. And at least we are beginning to talk more openly to one another about the whole issue. Thanks for your comments. Let's keep talking!

Emalani said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I just purchased Face It and as soon as I started reading it my thoughts were " This book is about me."  Those are my internal feelings and when I try to explain it to my friends they say to me , What are you talking about you look great.  Then I start to question myself which makes me crazy.  Being apart of this blog and reading your book is beginning to help me feel validated about my feelings.

Dr. Vivian Diller said to Emalani 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I’m hoping that “Face It” (and blog exchanges like this) help women become clearer about why they feel what they do at this time in their lives. Some women say they feel a sense of loss as they see the changes in their faces. Some feel scared or sad. Some even feel panic. Whether these are culturally induced, provoked by our biology, our personal or professional lives, women need to know they are not alone. And instead dismissing these feelings with “this shouldn’t be that important” or “don’t be silly,” we need to recognize that our attachment our youthful appearance is understandable. Loss and change is part of aging but not always easy to accept. Avoiding those emotions don’t make them go away. Likewise, getting a facelift doesn’t really resolve these complicated feelings either. Women who age gracefully find ways to come to terms with these emotions, let go and move on.

Emalani said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

That's what I want to do let go and move on.  I feel that my uh-oh moment is how I see myself in my mind.  In my mind the picture of myself is a young 25 year old image of myself.  Then I'll catch my reflection in window or department store mirror or see myself in a picture and then uh-oh who is that old person?

Maggie Rose said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I'm loving this discussion!  After having an epiphany in a hair salon, I decided to never color my hair again. HOW I was going to do that was a mystery, but I eventually found an option that worked for me. The gift in the process was, as my "silver lining" grew out, I was forced to come face-to-face with a deep well of emotional, social, spiritual and psychological issues around what it means to be a mature woman in a society obsessed with youth and manufactured beauty. It's been my experience that we tend to get what we expect, so I knew that if I left this cauldron of beliefs and expectations unexamined, they would dictate my experience and stir up a low level anxiety about what was to come as I aged.

While we don't all choose to go gray - we all come face-to-face with these beliefs about aging in our own way. For some it's the wrinkles and rolls that get harder to cover or ignore, for others, the changing landscape of home and family, or a career coming to a close or becoming unfulfilling.

I love, love , LOVE my silver head of hair. It's shiny, easy to manage...and short! But it's not about the hair. It's that the process of going gray gave me back my sense of authenticity. I was able to drop the roles and expectations that no longer served me, figure out who I am now, and make the choices that support me in living a purposeful life. Thank you for bringing this important topic to the forefront. I too, am a boomer aged author, and share my journey in: Amazing Grays - A Woman's Guide to Making the Next 50 the BEST 50 (regardless of your hair color!)

I hope it's okay that I mention my book here. There are so many great resources for maturing women, and I, for one, appreciate knowing where to find them. After all, I found you in this forum and now look forward to reading what you have to say!

Pam Massey said to lovezao 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I think the issue of gray hair has struck a sensitive cord, because women would like to be appreciated and accepted for who they are.  Let’s face it, the onus has always been on women to do whatever it takes to remain youthful in appearance.  Society as a whole has placed unreal expectations on women with regard to their physical appearance.  An excellent example of this is how women are viewed in the Paleolithic world of corporations. Not much has change in the basic framework of these giant dinosaurs since the industrial revolution.  The major tectonic changes took place only in the last couple of decades when women began breaking the glass ceiling and moving into top tier executive positions.  It is still considered somewhat of a novelty for a woman to be CEO of a Fortune 500 company, although this is occurring with much more regularity than ever before.  The male executives that dominate this culture seem to have no qualms in letting their hair turn gray.  Men have always been told that they look “distinguished” when their hair begins to gray. For them it seems to be synonymous with wisdom and experience.  However, women who decide to go gray are not viewed in the same positive light.  I have worked in this archaic environment for more than 30 years and recently I have decided to push the envelope a bit by letting my hair take its natural course and go gray.  I have arrived at a time in my personal and professional life where I feel that my accumulated experience and to some degree wisdom, should count for something.  The women who broke ground in corporate American and those who came after them were not vacuous show pieces.  They were and are women of considerable intellect and substance.  Until we finally learn to feel comfortable in our own skin, we will continue to buy into the youth oriented, market driven belief that our self worth is inextricably linked to our physical appearance.  Eleanor Roosevelt was far from being a runway model.  By societal standards she was judged to be very plain.  However, beneath that ordinary exterior was a beautiful and spirited woman full of humanity and considerable intelligence.  She was a woman ahead of her time and she played a very important role on the world stage during a pivotal time in our country’s history.  She left her mark on this world for all eternity.  How she looked paled in comparison to what she accomplished. If I could have even the smallest slice of what she and other women like her in history had, I would be extremely content.  The one common theme among these historical female role models is their deep sense of self and their commitment to their beliefs.  Not all of us are going to live our lives as stunning beauties, but it does not mean we don’t have valuable lives.  The aging process affects each of us in different ways.  Much of it has to do with genetics and the rest with proper care in terms of our health and well being.  Mostly, I strongly feel, that our true appeal and attractiveness does not come from our outward appearance as much as it does from an inner glow fired by a passion for living.  If we are truly engaged with life it gives us a certain vivacity or as the French say … a “ je ne sais qua";  a certain charm , an indefinable enchantment.  I am not negating the importance of being fit and healthy, I am simply saying that we miss a lot of what is real and important when we hyper focus on superficial appearance.  Every woman must do what is comfortable and right for her, be it coloring her hair or having procedures done.  I just want women to fully understand their value and worth apart from anything else.  As Eleanor Roosevelt said … “No one can make you feel inferior without your consent”.

2 members love this!
TRACK said to Pam Massey 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

You summed it up very nicely...TRACK

1 member loves this!
JoanPrice said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Gray hair on young models -- now that would be interesting! Cool concept!

Maggie De Vore said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

It's pure and simply a case of media/pharma/medical bamboozlement!!  We are such easy targets -- and most of the bamboozlement comes from men!  I've always wondered -- did the bra really get invented by a man??  Most torture divices are!!!

1 member loves this!
Cathryn Wellner said to Maggie De Vore 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I'm with you, Maggie - always wondered the same thing. So I just did a quick Web search and discovered quite a mixed-gender list of "inventers". The snopes.com article is fun - http://www.snopes.com/business/origins/bra.asp. Here's another take on it: http://www.mrbra.com/historyofbras.ivnu.

The chemical industry has been very successful in persuading us we don't look good, smell good, eat well, get well or stay healthy without massive doses of manufactured substances. Estimates abound, but accurate figures are harder to find since they are sold by research companies. Here's one interesting tidbit from TRESemmé (a hair products company): the average British woman spends $50,000 USD on her hair during her lifetime. (See The Cost of Gorgeous Hair.)

Nothing wrong with wanting to look our best, but I wonder if the billions of dollars spent annual actually make us happier and more satisfied with our lives. I'm pretty sure they don't make our planet happier since the chemicals end up in our water and food supply.

Aging...fascinating topic. I'm thoroughly enjoying the discussion and am quite comfortable in my grey-topped, no-longer-skinny-but-fit-and-healthy body.

3 members love this!
Maggie De Vore said to Cathryn Wellner 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

You are very right about the products that muck up the world for 15 minute 'vanity' fixes. 

And how can you be anti-aging when it's the most natural thing happening to you???

Maggie De Vore said to Maggie De Vore 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

P.S. -- also enjoying the discussion and comfortable in loose-fitting clothes, soft shoes, grey hair, healthy body, mind and spirit. 

Cathryn didn't mean you are anti-aging -- only those who prefer chemical to natural.

1 member loves this!
BonnieC said to Maggie De Vore 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I recall reading somewhere as well that the modern bra was invented by a woman in the early part of the 20th century.

 

At any rate, I include it in the trash bin of absurdities that tell us we are not acceptable as nature made us:  corsets, girdles, make-up etc.

I am in my 60's and have not worn a bra in years (excpet on rare occasions)  Mostly I wear stretch camisoles.  The bra is killing me by the end of the day; it restricts breathing. I am, btw, a 38D

There was a study done at a university in JApan during the early 1990's that found that wearing of bras actually INCREASES sagging, especially in LARGE-breasted women.

I am also concerned about the effect on lymph nodes for women who wear bras all day, and even at night.

Pam Massey said to BonnieC 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

This reminds me of a story of a very dear friend of mine and how she made a decision back in her late forties to do away with her bra.  She is a unique character and she disposed of her bra in a moment of spontaneity. She was out with friends for the evening and they were all caravanning to another place when they got stuck having to wait for a very slow train to pass.  My friend, right then and there, removed her bra and tossed it out the window.  Everyone in the other car following her just died laughing.  That was soooo her.  She hasn't worn a bra since and like you, she prefers the camisoles.  I personally think it was a blacksmith that invented the blast thing! I have, since the age of 15, had to wear bras with underwire. Though there have been some improvements over the years in the flexibility of the wire used, by the end of the day it feels as if I've been encased in a steel contraption.  It is the first garment I remove as soon as I reach home.  I was, unfortunately, given way too much "lung capacity" for my size and I have found that this capacity has, to my dismay, increased in menopause. For some women this may be a good thing and one of the upsides to the change.  However, I have reached a point in the alphabet that is bordering on the absurd.  I am seriously contemplating breast reduction. 

SusieQ321 said to Pam Massey 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Pam, I'm right there with you. It was the summer I turned 10 when my breasts blossomed from noting to a B cup. Since Perimenopause ( I am now Post Menopausal) they have blossomed past a 38DDD. I was told I would be better off in an E or G; I just won't go there. I spend the mone on a darn good DDD instead (it seems the more I pay, I am able to fit comfortably in the DDD).  I have been giving serious thought to a breast reduction at the age of 53.  Although, the thought of elective surgery makes me a wee bit nervous. Time will settle this for me.

Emalani said to SusieQ321 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I am starting the wonderful stage of menopause at the age of 53 and have gained 10 pounds and gone from a 34D to a 36DD. Nothing fits right now :( 

Dr. Vivian Diller said to BonnieC 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

The freedom to chose how to look is an important goal for contemporary woman. Just because the topic is about our appearance, doesn't make this issue superficial. It runs deep into the core of who we are as women, into our identity and sense of self.

Some women love the look (and don't mind the feel) of the push-up bra. Some women, like you, find any bra constricting. Spanx works for some. Others wouldn't spend an hour in it. The women who struggle, are those who feel we have to conform our appearance to a standard that others have made for us. As long as we feel comfortable with our choices and can enjoy how we look and feel, then we are enjoying the path our feminist forebearers paved for us. This is another phase of women's liberation; increasing the freedom to chose how we want to be women in today's world.

CarolMarlene said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Amen

Well said. I have friends who walk out the door looking like fashion models and are drop-dead gorgeous women over 60, including one who is 94. I'd never be mistaken for a fashion model and am totally comfortable in my casual clothes, grey hair, and saggy bits. Fashion makes me yawn. Style makes me dance. Being able to carve out our own paths is a gift.

1 member loves this!
TRACK said to BonnieC 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Yes, I wear bras to bed and everyday. I heard about the study also, however, my girls still have bounce and fairly firm, so I like them....TRACK

Paloba said to TRACK 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Track, be careful... A Harvard study in 1991 did show bra-free women had a lower rate of breast cancer than bra wearing women. ...cancer and lymphatic experts advise women not to wear tight bras because it can impair lymphatic drainage from the arms and chest and cause lymphedema.

Paloba said to Paloba 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I am someone who was a 36E and was reduced to a 36C. My breasts grew back to 36DDDD; had cancer and was made a 36C. They've grown back again and I am a 36E. This is breasts growing back not weight gain on my part. When I wear underwire for too long, I can actually feel a lymph node in my armpit and it hurts so the restriction is a fact, not hearsay.

Pam Massey said to Paloba 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Well, now I am officially depressed.  I had no idea that breast reduction surgery would not be permanent. I have been seriously considering having it done.  I am currently a 42H and my back and neck hurt constantly.  This is just too much weight on my upper body. However, it might be that I would luck out and not increase in size or at least not back to what I am now. I think anything at this point would be an improvement.  I agree that by the end of the day, underwires are very restricting and bordering painful.  

TRACK said to Paloba 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Thanks for the concern, maybe I'll stop wearing one to bed...TRACK

BonnieC said to TRACK 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

There are Sleep Bras, which are very soft and not restrictive, if you feel uncomfortable with nothing at night.

BonnieC said to TRACK 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

If you wear it because YOU like it, that's great.    It's the large number of women who are uncomfortable in a bra, but wear one anyway, because it's socially mandated, that I speak to.

I went into a Victoria's Secret store awhile back; they were having a sale on bras; a saleswoman greeted me at the door and asked me what size I wore..."I don't wear a bra," I said.  Her look at me was aghast as if I had said I committed a crime.

TRACK said to BonnieC 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

BonnieC, No sale hon, hahaha...good for you...TRACK

Dr. Vivian Diller said to BonnieC 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Everybody is different. If we take the word "body" literally, then it gives more meaning to how our bodies are different and we deal with them differently --bras and otherwise. What bothers me about attitude of the Victoria Secret saleswoman described above, is that she reacted with surprise (and perhaps even disdain?) at the chioce made by another woman. Why surprise? That "everybody" is different?

My experience when I tell another woman that I don't always wear a bra is more often envy, not disdain (could it be because I live in NYC?). Some tell me how lucky I am that I still have a dancer's body that doesn't require a bra. I never had large breasts and years of working out has kept me in shape. But I tell other women that there are 'ups and downs" to all shapes and sizes. I may not have to wear a bra, but that means I don't have the curves that some other women enjoy. "Viva la difference." We should come up with a phrase in English like this French one and bring it into American culture.

I have been watching this conversation blossom for weeks. It is a vibrant and refreshing example of the change which you say is coming in the way mature women will percieve themsleves and will be perceived by society.

Recently I was asked to comment on women who have experienced changes in their bodies due to age and who are happy with the changes

Below is my response but first, thank you for the stimulating this rich pool of thought and for giving so many of us a place to raise our voices.

 

I would like to suggest to you that based on my experience interviewing woman 50+,there is another possible approach to your article.
For example I have gained approximately 20 pounds in the last 10 years since my 50 birthday.
Am I happy with that...no. I would like to have those skinny thighs and flat tummy back again. I have always been slim and this new "matronly" figure does not thrill me at all.
However, happiness or sadness over my new appearance is not the issue . I have developed and am still developing, a whole new perspective on life which allows me to still be happy with me and my life, 20 pounds up or not.
I remember distinctly the internal conversation I had with myself about my weight gain while trying in vain one day to struggle into my old skinny jeans.
I knew I could beat this weight thing. I could change my diet drastically and accelerate my exercise program but...why?
I am not unhealthy, still within a "normal" or average weight range and active enough to have good heart and muscle health.
So what would drive me to deny myself the food and wine I love and to take time from other pursuits I prefer?
I realized it would not loose those pounds for me but for the external validation that so much of my body image concerns had catered too all my life
So I raised the weight point that was acceptable to me. I can look in the mirror and most days say...that is fine.
I have changed my clothing style  but fabulously to suit my personality.
I am known to be flamboyant in my clothes and I celebrate my flare and my nomadic life style by wearing  wonderful fabrics which come from all over the world.
Yes I have left the tighter pants and pencil skirts, size 2, behind but what I wear now is for me and I can still feel very sexy. This feeling comes now from a deep and confident place inside me so it is there no matter what the external world gives back to me.If others like what they see that is nice but if they don't ...quite frankly I don't care...now that is a freedom that is the gift of aging.
I found in my research for Fifty and Fabulous; The Best Years of a Woman's Life that this internal evaluation process is applied to many areas of life from sexuality to personality.
As we become more conscious of ourselves and  self knowledge fills us up we also begin the process of accepting ourselves. In the acceptance is the ability to be at peace with something that is not perhaps ideal.
I would like to have a perfectly flat tummy but I do not and I value other things so much more than that now . I accept my shape and my acceptance of my shape and I live peacefully with the ambiguity of wanting a flat tummy and being quite happy without one
  We gain in aging, what many women have lacked their entire lives...comfort in our own skin.

1 member loves this!
Emalani said to Jaki -- fiftyfab.com 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Thank you for sharing.  That is exacting what I am trying to give myself permission to do.  I have also put on 20 pounds since entering the wonderful phase of my life called menopause.  Yes it is sad  to let go of the young slim body as everything turns into cottage cheese, but your right how much effort do I want to put onto it.  There are so many wonderful things going on right now in my life so I think I'll put my energy into them.

Jaki -- fiftyfab.com said to Emalani 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Cottage cheese? I love that ...my new name for cellulite. I am sure this will make me embrace those little bumps so much more!

Thank you for your comment and have fun out there

Dr. Vivian Diller said to Emalani 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

 

I just want to add to Jacki’s and Emalani's comments by reminding us all, that the psychological process that helps women eventually feel Fifty and Fabulous includes experiencing loss. Sometimes this loss runs deeper and feels stronger than we anticipate because it is often provoked by what we dismiss as a superficial issue –our changing appearance. But loss of our shape, our strength or our youthful self-image strikes at the core of our identity, of who we are as women. The loss requires letting go of an experience of ourselves that we have come to know. Yes, as Jacki says, trying to hold on or hold back these changes is not worth the effort and is inevitably impossible. That is the challenge facing maturing women. We have to learn to mourn the losses, accept the changes and be open to what is next. We learned to move on from childhood to adolescence and into adulthood and we need to be flexible as we approach midlife. Since we now live decades beyond menopause, (unlike any previous generations), we need to look forward rather than backward. We need to allow ourselves feeling of sadness about our losses, so we can embrace the pleasures available to us in our futures. 

3 members love this!
Emalani said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Mahalo for all the sharing!  It is really helping me move on with a more positive attitude.:)

I agree with you Dr Diller that part of the experience of aging is loss, indeed part of the experience of life is loss.

To understand a woman’s role in society 50+ I interviewed women who embraced this time of their lives, vibrant, sparking women from 45 to 102. I called these women the Women of the Harvest because they nourished their lives with a harvest of self knowledge which they had accumulated by living both the good and the bad days of their years up to the present.

 One Woman of the Harvest told me, reflecting on the obsession to stay young, “It is sad to age in fear of the absence of something you don’t have anymore, like youth.” But in Western society particularly, the prevalent image of aging is one of loss.

The Women of the Harvest are not exempt from the natural processes of age. They endure their own physical decline as an inescapable reality. It is not that life presents a different reality for those who have embraced aging. It is their attitude toward our shared reality that distinguishes them.

This distinguishing attitude appears to have something to do with their ability to live in the present and to accept what that present moment brings, both good and bad.

My experience with grief is one of deep pain in the moment which eases with time and never completely leaves but settles in some place inside me where I can live with it as part of what I have become because of it.

When I talk about accepting the changes in my body I do not suggest I am frivolously dismissing that which is causing me pain or turning my back in denial. I know these are temporary band aids at best.

I speak of acceptance as the process of acknowledging there is something present which I do not like, do not prefer, a change that has moved me from a state I would like to have kept …and so there is pain . But I also know that change is the way of life and one day it will bring what I enjoy and the next day something I would much prefer to be without.

When acceptance comes it is a great blessing because without it I waste my time fighting something in the mistaken belief that it should not exist. That fight in my opinion is the cause of suffering and pain is bad enough without suffering.

Of course this acceptance does not always come but when it does and I can be present for whatever is here I never cease to be amazed at what else the change has brought to my life.

Thank you again fora great stimulating VN discussion

 

1 member loves this!

Jaki, your ideas are so well thought out and beautifully written. I am very grateful for being invited to join the interchange between women on this site who have shared so much wisdom and generosity. I have a lot to learn from "Women of the Harvest." If we keep the conversation going and keep learning from each other, who knows what other gifts might come as we age!

We have here the gift of meaningful conversation... aren't we lucky?

Like you Vivian I am very grateful for not only VN and the fabulous women here but for the yeras that brought me here.

To all those who have taken time to write to this post, I just wanted you to know that as a result of this interesting interchange, I suggested that Vibrant Nation offer, "Face It: What Women Really Feel As Their Looks Change" for their book club so it can help stimulate the kind of attitude some of you seem to have embraced on your own. It hasn’t been selected as of yet, but I hope it will be. You see, for a lot of women in my practice, they don’t see things the way some of you describe above. They talk about feeling anxious as they approach 40, 50 and beyond. They are pessimistic about their future and angry at the limitations that age brings. I would like to hear the reactions my book gets from others on this site, to see if the stories from the women I wrote about resonate with them. Are these struggles more prevalent in NYC where my patients are from? From cities on the East and West Coast that are more youth and beauty obsessed? Having spoken to journalists from other big cities, like Paris, London, Tokyo, Dublin, Lisbon and Buenos Aires, I think this is an international struggle, but I would like to hear from women from small towns, real women from outside of the media.

If any of you have time, I would appreciate it if readers here suggest “Face It” as a book club selection on VN or any women's site. I think it just may stimulate more interesting conversation and may even get me to write my next book! Meanwhile, we can all try to spread the positive attitude about women, aging and their future. When you feel good, it feels even better to share the good feelings with others, right? And, if more of us midlifers walked around feeling grateful, as Jaki wrote above, for the years that have brought us here, we would see more smiles and more beauty around us.

I'm a third of the way through the book, Vivian, and I can tell you it is forcing me to "face" my own masks. I've always been comfortable about aging but realize, in reading your book, there are things I've pushed aside and need to grapple with. I'll write more of a reaction after I finish the book.

I look forward to hearing what you think after you are done. I am hoping the book Face It continues to stimulate conversation on this topic and opens women up to their own thoughts and feelings, that like you, may have been "masked." Beauty is an issue that often is dismissed as irrelevant in the aging process especially among smart, evolved women. So I hope the book offers a way for women to find a solution to how to keep their aging appearance in balance with other aspects that clearly matter too. Let me know what you think.

Matriarch said to Jaki -- fiftyfab.com 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Attitude is paramount in this journey.  The only thing that declines in most of us in our bodies.  If we work to keep our minds sharp we can grow still.  We are not our bodies, we are so much more and when these bodies give out we still have capacities to love, to give, to take, and grow and that is what we all must embrace.  Focusing on the losses attracts more loss, focus on what you still have, still can do will attract that creative force that says, "I can't run a marathon anymore, but I can support those who can by volunteering, or walk in my beautiful garden, and be thankful that I can walk, for there are many farther in the journey who cannot."   

Katielli said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

No one seems to be asking "WHY do we want to continue to look young?" Do women feel that beauty is their currency in life, like men feel they are valued by how much they make?What do we feel we will lose by getting old? Attention? Validation from men? Participation in the affairs of humanity? What is it? I'm seriously asking!

TRACK said to Katielli 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Katie, These are excellent questions, For me I like to look good no matter what my age is! I do take care...TRACK
p.s. Don't want to go back to thirty even for looks...

Dr. Vivian Diller said to TRACK 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I'm responding here again to  Katielli's question "WHY" (as I did previously in an earlier reply) because I wanted to make sure that TRACK, you read it too. This reply supports your feeling that you "like to look good no matter what" your age is.  I wrote:

Katielli, it’s not true that no one is looking at the questions you raise. These issues are of great interest to me and others who are researching this area, so I'm glad you are "seriously asking."  For the long answer,  I'm going to refer you to the book I wrote called, “Face It: What Women Really Feel As Their Looks Change” which has some good answers to your questions. Take a look at it, especially chapter 6, called “Letting Go and Moving On.”

Here, though, is my short answer. There are research studies showing that beauty has biological roots and that humans are hard wired to find youthful attractiveness appealing. Sociologists look at our culture for explanations, describing how youth has become equated with beauty in media, which reinforces this equation and narrows the standards of what we see as attractive. Anthropologists examine the association between attractiveness, fertility and survival of the species. For millions of years women’s role was to attract a mate and procreate and though our roles have changed dramatically, (especially post feminism), old habits die hard. From this point of view, you are correct that attractiveness serves as a kind of currency and power. Existentialists offer another perspective, focusing on how the fear of death is avoided by a constant yearning for youth. An aging face makes us confront our mortality and human go to great lenghts to avoid that experience.

This brief summary simplifies a very complex issue, but take a look at a more in depth discussion in my book. I describe what women really feel as their looks changes, giving psychological explanations to the impact these changes have on the core of who we are. I’d be interested if you find that “Face It” has satisfactory answers to your very valid questions.

BonnieC said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

Therre are societies that revere and respect thier elders.  Ours is not one of them.  I hope the "baby boomers" can change this. (Yes I am one of them)

In America today, the aged are often thought to be weak, forgetful and non-productive.  It's very difficult for a person over 50 to find a new job or change careers, even though the statistics show that older workers are productive.

1 member loves this!
TRACK said to Dr. Vivian Diller 05/12/2010, 02:15PM new!

I still say much is taught at HOME! Our children see and hear what grown folk adore and admire and wish for themselves. If our son continually hear who's pretty, attractive, beautiful according to Mom and Dad, plus relatives, friends they are programmed already against certain feature and looks AND AGE.
If your son brings an older female home, mostly mom will not like his choice, She's too old for you! Mom is not concerned about his happiness but grandchildren he might not even want children, you see her choice about what she wants. We teach our children against age, and not let them see the different beauty there is in others. When daughter says she is bring home boyfriend what is ask of her, "Is he good-looking or handsome?, nothing about character or how he's treating her first! We have programmed our young people against ourselves.
Women here on VN talk about how men say they're too old, when the males themselves are old! But these males remember what was taught at home and choose accordingly. How these grown males don't consider women over 50 much. We are living what we have taught...TRACK

Pure and Natural